Conformation in Mid-West hounds

[WELLS WOODS]

You will not see 50' overruns & 75 yard checks when the trial gets down to the best hounds; if you do, the judges have done a very poor job of selecting the best hounds. I have never seen a dog finish in the Mid-West that runs as reckless as you describe our hounds. What Mid-West trials have you attended ? I've never known anyone named gwyoung from all of my years in the Mid-West.

Have you got a video of your dogs, so I can try to see why we are disagreeing so much? ; then maybe we can agree to disagree.

[gwyoung]

wells woods, I wouldn't blame it on the judges. they don't have much to work with. I don't enter Midwest trials wouldn't own a hound like that, but I do go as a spectator at times but haven't for awhile the two that I have visited are not too big a drive from here and I may visit the one at their next trial just to do a little video if they would allow me. I might get away with it if they don't know what I am going to do with the video! One that I went too use to be a real nice club a non-Midwest style I heard until it was taken over by mid-west. A buddy of mine that runs a fairly cleaning running dog took some of his and I went along with him I think it was the first year Midwest had it, he had run there previously, I can't say that I didn't enjoy myself that day it was Hilarious , that is the worst that I have seen them though but not by a heck of a lot. I have a guy that I squirrel hunt about twice a year who lives farther south than I do who currently runs in Midwest he doesn't have any field champions that I am aware of but I know he does place dogs. I don't care for them and he doesn't care that I don't care. lol.. we still kill a lot of squirrels though, he is a member on here and can speak up if he wishes. I have posted some videos on here of my hounds . If you want I could look them up! And if you don't see the best hounds with 50' overruns and 75 yard checks than that is much different than what I have seen. and is that true to their blood, most that I have seen are harehounds and there is a ton of Branko influence, something that may not concern me too much if I ran hare more than I do now, but do not want on a cottontail!

[WELLS WOODS]

You would enjoy the UBGF board better, unless you just like telling people how much their dogs suck.

[gwyoung]

Wells Woods , don't care for ubgf hounds, dislike them almost as much as Midwest can't stand the yapping! Not telling you your hounds suck, just telling you in my opinion what I see in them that I wouldn't own them. . I just disagreed with your opinion that Midwest are the best in both conformation and running , you do not have the superior product in everyone elses mind as they are in yours, you may have to somehow come to terms with that as hard as it may be for you to understand. I give my opinion I don't care if you don't like it, but for someone who doesn't you sure keep right on posting toward me! Try not doing that and see if it helps any!

[WELLS WOODS]

What style do you like then? Or is it just field trials in general that you don't like ? So your hounds are better than all the Mid-West & UBGF hounds; I get it now.

[Casey Harner]

I've been to about five or six Midwest trials. The winners pack has been awesome from the ones I've witnessed. They pounded hard for over two hours. To witness a strong winners pack is very exciting to watch, as they get down to five the stakes are raised and it seemed like the running gets better, because of how strong those five are. From what I've seen in winners pack, there isn't any crazy dogs there, since most were picked up. If one of the five does swing or cheat, the other four usually makes him/her pay and she is caught by the judge's eyes and picked up. The dogs will sort out who is the strongest and who is the weakest...in my limited time in the Midwest I haven't seen a dog that stood around yet, not saying it doesn't happen cause I'm sure it does. I have seen where judges will talk to the hounds to keep them in the same area. I agree to disagree with it. There are some clubs where there might be a busy road and all hounds need to be together if they aren't running. What I don't like about talking to your hounds to hunt, is that I don't do that. My dogs would probably be nervous as if they were being scolded at... Only time I say anything to them is if they are doing something bad or if I kill a rabbit I give them praise....

[gwyoung]

Like attending field trials as I have said many times, don't get to go as often as I like and I don't enter dogs. I am just not a trailer, I just can't get into it that much but I see why others like it, It would take too much of my time and not only does the wife not enjoy a day with the dogs like that It would be hard for me to attend trials as my days off are rarely on weekends. And to be honest with you if I thought I had a hound that could win every trial I took it to and I wouldn't have to attend 5 or 6 trials to become a F.C. I would see to it that the hound got there . Most attend three times that amount of trials to finish one I wouldn't want a field champion at that expense . I have ran with a few field champions and most seem to do at least something very well I have owned and have seen a lot of hounds that are not trialed that would be more than capable of finishing. But it seems pointless to me to be able to call a hound a field champion that actually won on good attendance , I wouldn't care to have one that it took eight trials to finish it wouldn't mean much to me . but I do understand why folks like to trial , I am glad they do as I like to attend one every now and then. I am not knocking anyones F.C. like I say I believe it is a fair measure of a hound ( even though all F.C. are not equal) and most F.C. seem to do at least one thing very well, and not a bad place to start one's search for a stud dog. I like the PBGA style of hound he runs an acceptable line with what I call an acceptable amount of foot, I will see if I can post a video of my hounds here, but I am not too good at that!

[WELLS WOODS]

The Mid-West keeps growing every year it seems. Nothing more fun & exciting to me than beagling & trialing when I have a good one. I would do it year round , 7 days a week if I had the time & money.
It will take even the best hounds 10 or more trials to get 3 wins & 120 points. The competition is fierce! There are very few hounds good enough to become an AKC Mid-West FC.

[Moore Beagles]

I'll post a 10 sec clip of Show dogs runnin today in the 80 degree Heat, since We can't come up with any Real Rabbit Dog clips....
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=82 ... 5478104400
The Last dog coming thru is from AKC FC Blood He's usually the one I have to Kick in the Rear, never The Show dogs...

Heres my young prospect workin a Check, Thought about calling Her over to it, and Yellin Tally Ho, but instead I just let Her work it Out...
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=82 ... 5587202670

Not where We want to be yet, but Were getting there..

[gwyoung]

Wells woods, You say it is tough to become a Midwest field champion, Is that because of the numbers, because I thought a winner had to be declared at EVERY trial regardless of the performance turned in. extremely poor performance still equals a winner . I understand about the three wins, but someone is going to be a winner everytime, regardless of performance. This is also true in the other formats ?

[WELLS WOODS]

Competition & talent level is why it's so hard to become a Mid-West FC. You might as well let go of your theory that the Mid-West hounds winning are faulty & undeserving; I've seen too much & know better.

[WELLS WOODS]

Moore, you've got a long road ahead of you trying to make great rabbit hounds from show blood, but I appreciate your enthusiasm.

[gwyoung]

wells woods, not saying that, but you seem to be saying it is harder to become a midwest F.C. than in any other format. Do you think that the other hounds in other formats that become F.C. have had very little competition and the talent level there has been low? I don't know as I am not a trailer and I know you must visit the other formats regularly to be aware of what is going on over there and as I have said I don't so I will have to take your word for the lack of talent and competition in the other formats, if you say it is so , I believe you but it must have changed fairly quickly! As far as faulty and undeserving, You are not correct on this they are deserving if they beat the other hounds, so deserving absolutely. Faulty, yes in my opinion of what I have seen, but once again that is my opinion it differs from yours that doesn't bother me though and I am sure you are alright with it as well!

[Casey Harner]

I'll post a 10 sec clip of Show dogs runnin today in the 80 degree Heat, since We can't come up with any Real Rabbit Dog clips....
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=82 ... 5478104400
The Last dog coming thru is from AKC FC Blood He's usually the one I have to Kick in the Rear, never The Show dogs...

Heres my young prospect workin a Check, Thought about calling Her over to it, and Yellin Tally Ho, but instead I just let Her work it Out...
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=82 ... 5587202670

Not where We want to be yet, but Were getting there..

Gregg Moore, nice videos... I like that video of them coming through on the line..


Greg Wells,

Don't understand your attitude, that video of dogs coming though on the line seemed to me they had the line good and was showing brains. Not sure how warm it its today there, but I'm guessing its warm like its here.... I bet they can run with the Midwest hounds easily...

[WELLS WOODS]

gwyoung, I have no idea how the competition is in other formats. I never said there was a lack of competition anywhere. I just know it is very high in the Mid-West. That's all I got for you man.
Casey, I wasn't talking about the videos. The dogs looked fine, except only two of the four were barking in the first video & the young dog in the other one was tight mouthed. I'm just saying it is going to be extremely hard to develop a hunting line using only show blood; no one has ever done it in the Mid-West. I'm not rooting against the Moore's, just giving my opinion.

P.S. The dog in the lead in the first video was doing a fine job !