Breeding for NOSE POWER

[NorWester1]

How many of you guys are breeding for nose power in your hounds?
What sort of criteria &/or strategy are you using to build this trait or combination of traits into your hounds and how do you evaluate the finished product?
What sort of drawbacks or stumbling blocks have you encountered?

[BCBeagles]

Sent you a pm. Thanks!

[S.R.Patch]

When I become discouraged with the struggle of hounds over the faint scented crafty cottontail, I load hounds and head to the great white north to run the stinky hare. It always lifts the spirits and restores the confidence of hounds when in a head high scented race to the finish, that Molly Cottontail could never hope to provide.
Nothing overcomes the destitute of doubt an failure, like the invigoration of success...
If times are really tough, I try to find one rabbit that stinks more than all the rest at that place in time, so hounds don't relapse an fall back into despair.

As for improvement in the nose department, I've pondered an infusion of the species Vermilingua (meaning "worm tongue") commonly known as the anteater. I'm told, more superior nose design and scenting powers are unheard of....this is all just theory as of yet you understand, nothing proven...
But now, the drawback of where to secure such an animal and the problem of getting a hound to "stand" for it...{pun intended}... along with the baggage it may carry...

[chapkosbeagles]

Cant trail a rabbit with no nose

I have been working on breeding nose and hunt in with these superfast line breed snapps hounds and having fair success. I admire a good snow hound as that is when I rabbit hunt

[Owl Creek]

Get ahold of Dan Kane (HappyRun Kennels) up there.
he has already done it. he is a HOF breeder of HOF hounds . i know 2 of which were 3 time sire and dam of the year ( in a row).
their pups are reproduceing as well.there is some HappyRun Calio Clem blood down here in the US that is producing very well .
he is on this board but not offten.
you can see clems Ped on my web site. look at annie or sandie's page.
i maybe able to come up with his e-mail if you decide to look him up.
shoot me a msg via
owlcreek@ymail.com
best of luck
Steve

[Budd]

Cant trail a rabbit with no nose

I have been working on breeding nose and hunt in with these superfast line breed snapps hounds and having fair success. I admire a good snow hound as that is when I rabbit hunt

Chapko, you say you are haveing some sucess with the snapps hounds, could you break it down a little more by telling us
What sort of criteria &/or strategy are you using to build this trait or combination of traits into your hounds and how do you evaluate the finished product?
What sort of drawbacks or stumbling blocks have you encountered?
Have you created all of your cold nosed breeding stock or bought them. I see you sell several litters every year so how do you know what crosses are produceing nose power if you are selling most of the pups and not evaluating them yourself, other than just going by what their new owners tell you? I have seen dogs that their owners raved about the nose power they posses but not be able to get the job done from my observation.
I beleave level of nose power is limited to were one lives and runs their dogs.
What about you patch, other than breeding to ant eaters?

[NorWester1]

Not looking to buy a dog guys.........just a discussion. There's gotta be some guys on this board who breed for "big nose" .... what's your game plan for doing so? What sort of troubles do you run into, if any, breeding for that big nose? Regardless of where you hunt and run there has to be some sort of strategy for putting the nose in your hounds

[pilotknob]

Good post Norwester,I would like to hear about it also.The times I've tried it I ended up with hounds that were too mouthy for me to tolerate.Ended up not keeping any of them,although several people that got them asked me to make the same cross again they loved them.I guess it all boils down to what you like in a hound and are willing to put up with.When senting conditions were bad I must admit I had alot better running,but when they were good the extra barking drove me crazy.

[fjg2]

we seem to get along breeding good nosed "gun dogs"; always mindful of hunting over other friends hounds, going to spoh trials in the most brutal months of winter to watch for prospects which can grovel to achieve forward progress when others cant. '

Dont breed for titles>>>ever............

it seems alot of fellas are tricked by hound mouth; and call it good nose? but does the forward progress come with it?
I can forgive alittle extra mouth but there better be alot of "forward progress" with it!! and by that I mean, the extra barker better be able to forward progress when a cleaner dog cant ............or

I have seen times when a big nosed hound will get confused with forward and backwards; but again............the backwards better not be far nor often and the individual hound doing this better out perform the ones that are not doing it!!

Have not seen a perfect hound yet; but I aint give up either. I guess at the end of the day, on the way home from a hunt if you are proud of your hound then you are on the right track.........I just dont want to be that guy in our hunting party that seems to always have his out cuz he dont know what he DONT have. Humble pie is hard to swallow if you have pride in your hounds; I certainly dont want to live on it !

I have had my share of days when a hunting buddy put a whoopin on me; but I guarantee you I wont be the NBQ of the day either. We all gotta give the devil his due; if you cant beat the other dog as much as he beats you than breed to him or get a pup from him.

however we seem to get too focused on one aspect of what makes a gun dog a legend; Its the whole package

Nose / line control / brains / handling / eager & industrious hunter

JMO but its kept my pants on more days than not

[littlewoody]

I have heard guys get jealous of Green Bay hounds. I don't understand please fill me in .

[Bunnyblaster]

I'm jealous of anyone that has a better hound than me........and there's quite a few!!

[S.R.Patch]

Cant trail a rabbit with no nose

I have been working on breeding nose and hunt in with these superfast line breed snapps hounds and having fair success. I admire a good snow hound as that is when I rabbit hunt

Chapko, you say you are haveing some sucess with the snapps hounds, could you break it down a little more by telling us
What sort of criteria &/or strategy are you using to build this trait or combination of traits into your hounds and how do you evaluate the finished product?
What sort of drawbacks or stumbling blocks have you encountered?
Have you created all of your cold nosed breeding stock or bought them. I see you sell several litters every year so how do you know what crosses are produceing nose power if you are selling most of the pups and not evaluating them yourself, other than just going by what their new owners tell you? I have seen dogs that their owners raved about the nose power they posses but not be able to get the job done from my observation.
I beleave level of nose power is limited to were one lives and runs their dogs.
What about you patch, other than breeding to ant eaters?

That's all I got Budd, this topic comes out every year with the Christmas records, but this year it's out before the Thanksgiving Day turkey is gone. Nothing is ever settled, someone's always got it tougher, field trials are ruining the hounds, we beat the dead horse over an over, some people thrive on controversy. I think we all have our "ideal" in mind, what is necessary and what is tolerated.
You can pull this topic up from years past an see how it ends, I doubt anyone has changed their minds.
Hope you had a good Thanksgiving with your family...

[birmi1nr]

I can't say that I'm breeding for nose power because I have yet to do much breeding of my own, but I am buying dogs/pups for nose power and have experienced the good and the bad of a cold nose. Ultimetly what has kept me from breeding my own hounds just yet is that of the 20 or so dogs I've owned I've yet to have have a male and female that I think are a worthy match for what I'm after. I'm getting close now with half the equation of what I like but still looking for the other half.

I place a big CORRECT snow nose a top of the list of attributes that I seek in my dogs, but the pitfalls of a big nose are some of the most difficult to contend with in my opinion ecspecially in the trial game. More often than not the big nose has got me in trouble in trial situations because of the little extra bark that goes with it. I'm not talking about babbling idiot cold nose barking (that I don't tolerate) just the little extra that a cold nose dog usually has in the check or before the rabbit is up. To a judge that doesn't know your dog this is faulty even though in your mind you know your dog has scent and will likely work it out and look like a hereo eventually but there is only so much time in trial to find the best and you as a judge take the faults and the good as you get them.

I like to think I run a big nose dog in my kennel with all my dogs except one, and he is the dog I have had the most trial success with as of late. Do I think this dog is my best dog because of his trial success; no. He's a nice dog and does some nice work with few mistakes when conditions are favorable, but when the scenting gets tough he is unable to contribute much to the race, when the rest of my dogs are able to still get plenty of work done. When the conditions are favorable the other dogs are able to get it done but this dog is just able to do it a bit cleaner and faster which wins more times than not in trial. Do I think trials are are a bad thing......non what so ever I attend and judge more than my fair share of trials every year and enjoy the heck out of it and have judged and seen many a good dog, but have seen very few that could do it day in and day out in all conditions. The ones that show up on the bench when running is good and when the running is less than favorable are the ones that I pay attention to.

A little of the topic but my experience and 2-cents.

[pilotknob]

Who out there has a line of dogs that they consider powerful nosed that can lock on one in the driest part of the summer.But in the winter won't open before the rabbit is jumped or will stay quiet on a frosty morning.And still has good foot to them,nothing superfast mid west SP or a little slower.I'm not trying to stur anything up,thats the type of hound I'm really looking for.

[bucks better beagles]

S.R. say what you want, but that first post was sure brilliance and as good an answer as I have ever heard to this inane question. You have it down brother.