I DID notice that BOTH of you, Rufus AND Charles went out of your way to AVOID mentioning GOVERNMENT REGULATION.
Thats what I figured I would get. You BOTH blame the COMPANIES instead of the government handlers pulling all the strings.
How "cheap" would oil and NG get IF coal was allowed to compete in a FAIR MARKET?
My wager is IF you could get government OUT OF THE darn WAY then ALL energy would come down.
When is the last time a new refinery was built HERE IN THIS COUNTRY? ANY IDEAS?
Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
Moderators: Pike Ridge Beagles, Aaron Bartlett
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
The 1st amendment allows the usual liberal narcissistic "I think.." which is how they start all their sentences.
The second amendment protects us from implementing "I think"
The second amendment protects us from implementing "I think"
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
Pine Mt Beagles wrote:Patch
One thing around here that is gong on now is the bigger companies are shutting down -and opening back up under a different I.D.number offering lower pay and no benefits.
That tactic came from the Reagan administration. Reagan invented the "permanent" "part time " employee. Companies run split shifts , get 40 hours production or more . Yet only pay part time minimum wages and know benefits . The biggest scam ever perpetrated on the American working class, and the beginning of the end of middle class America.
Big Mike
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Pine Mt Beagles
- Posts: 7803
- Joined: Wed May 11, 2005 6:01 pm
- Location: Pineville Ky
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
Regulations- rarely change except in during -Republican -campaigns-If a coal company goes into business they know -what the regulations are -They know they are responsable for complying with them ,Regulations are not te problem .greed is the problem.Regulations don't get changed with out giving companies time to comply.
Don't forget the -faulty switches -causing the oil spill -the company knew they were Bad-But- under Bush and Cheney they also knew -they didn't have to comply.they gambled with the environment --and--the environment lost causing- decades of destruction -the oil companies won,they made millions.
Don't forget the -faulty switches -causing the oil spill -the company knew they were Bad-But- under Bush and Cheney they also knew -they didn't have to comply.they gambled with the environment --and--the environment lost causing- decades of destruction -the oil companies won,they made millions.
If a man shuts his ears to the cry of the poor, he too will cry out and not be answered
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Rabbithoundjb
- Posts: 4517
- Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2006 4:30 pm
- Location: Rocky Mount, NC
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
ITS OBAMAS FAULT.
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
Here's my input on Gov. Regulation, I know you have trouble understanding what i write.bluegrass wrote:I DID notice that BOTH of you, Rufus AND Charles went out of your way to AVOID mentioning GOVERNMENT REGULATION.
Thats what I figured I would get. You BOTH blame the COMPANIES instead of the government handlers pulling all the strings.
How "cheap" would oil and NG get IF coal was allowed to compete in a FAIR MARKET?
My wager is IF you could get government OUT OF THE darn WAY then ALL energy would come down.
When is the last time a new refinery was built HERE IN THIS COUNTRY? ANY IDEAS?
To more define what I said, These plants are no longer "Grandfathered" under the EPA ruling. They have to meet all Fed Reg. today. Companies knew this about 15yr. ago, the time line was "limited" not indefinite.Grandfathered plants have to install scrubbers and nox controls. Many of these plants are small older plants from what I know of. there time line was limited.
The turbine upgrade we did gained us about 30 mw, the low NOX tuning they did on the boiler(running cooler w/ overfire air) took the gain away from the upgrade costing us more per megawatt. People want clean air and we can give it to them but it comes at an unsubsidized cost to coal burners.
A windmill will just about pay for it'self before it wears out, the subsidizes it gets pushes the price of power down where we can't compete in this constricted market unless it gets hot or cold, then even gas can't cover it because there's not the infrastructure to supply enough gas turbines without sucking the home heating supply down.
Gas, oil, coal is like air in a balloon, squeeze one and the other becomes a bigger bubble to "POP". jmho
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
S.R.Patch wrote:They have to meet all Fed Reg. today. Companies knew this about 15yr. ago, the time line was "limited" not indefinite.
Soooo...are you saying that the CURRENT regulations that coal companies have to meet were enacted 15 years ago or so? Ok...
Just which administration was that???
CLIN...
Oh nevermind.
As for this little dig:
S.R.Patch wrote: I know you have trouble understanding what i write.
I defy ANYONE not fluent in Poor Richards Almanac speak to regularly make sense of your posts Charles.
The 1st amendment allows the usual liberal narcissistic "I think.." which is how they start all their sentences.
The second amendment protects us from implementing "I think"
The second amendment protects us from implementing "I think"
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
No, I think you understand very well, it's what you pick and choose... 
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wvmuskyhunter
- Posts: 78
- Joined: Sat Feb 28, 2009 8:28 pm
- Location: Cameron,WV
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
Guys I normally dont get into these dicussions. I just recently went to a seminar by AEP. Their CEO gave a speech about regulations and closings of plants in Ohio and West Virginia. He said the the regulations imposed by the EPA under Obama gave them 1 year to comply. He said the work they would have to do to be in compliance would take atleast 3 years. You are looking at 20,000 jobs lost. On another not Murray Energy has signs posted at its mines FIRE OBAMA STOP THE WAR ON COAL. We have had rallies recently to stop the war on coal. They are drawing about 3,000 local people.
Just some info that I know. This came from the companies effected by the regulations. Just some facts, Im sure some of you guys will try to twisted them around, but straight from the horses mouth. Take the blame and quit putting it on someone else. If that is this administrations polocies admit it. Obama said before the last elections
he would close all coal fired power plants. It was front page news. You guys don't have to be upset and blame everyone else. Obama has already stated what he wanted to do.
Just some info that I know. This came from the companies effected by the regulations. Just some facts, Im sure some of you guys will try to twisted them around, but straight from the horses mouth. Take the blame and quit putting it on someone else. If that is this administrations polocies admit it. Obama said before the last elections
he would close all coal fired power plants. It was front page news. You guys don't have to be upset and blame everyone else. Obama has already stated what he wanted to do.
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Pine Mt Beagles
- Posts: 7803
- Joined: Wed May 11, 2005 6:01 pm
- Location: Pineville Ky
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
So do you guy's favor -Your Children -having air to breath-you are continually talking about the debt Bush left on them-and the 750,000 jobs a month he was loosing-what about the bad air -our children want need jobs or ave to worry about the debt -if-they can't breath-these companies -have the option to fix them or-shut them down.
I was in Sandiago California in 1971 -and you could not see the sky some times for the green air.!!!The air looked like you could put it in a jug.
The 112 -th-Congress with a -10 -approval rating should has the responsability to how this President accountable -To ad they have been on strike for the last few years.
Summary
Since Barack Obama was sworn in as President in 2009, the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has proposed and promulgated numerous regulations implementing the pollution control statutes enacted by Congress. Critics have reacted strongly. Many, both within Congress and outside of it, have accused the agency of reaching beyond the authority given it by Congress and ignoring or underestimating the costs and economic impacts of proposed and promulgated rules. The House has conducted vigorous oversight of the agency in the 112th Congress, and has approved several bills that would overturn specific regulations or limit the agency’s authority. Particular attention is being paid to the Clean Air Act, under which EPA has moved forward with the first federal controls on emissions of greenhouse gases and also addressed emissions of conventional pollutants from a number of industries.
Environmental groups and others disagree that the agency has overreached, and EPA states that critics’ focus on the cost of controls obscures the benefits of new regulations, which, it estimates, far exceed the costs; and it maintains that pollution control is an important source of economic activity, exports, and American jobs. Further, the agency and its supporters say that EPA is carrying out the mandates detailed by Congress in the federal environmental statutes.
This report provides background information on recent EPA regulatory activity to help address these issues. It examines 41 major or controversial regulatory actions taken by or under development at EPA since January 2009, providing details on the regulatory action itself, presenting an estimated timeline for completion of the rule (including identification of related court or statutory deadlines), and, in general, providing EPA’s estimates of costs and benefits, where available. The report includes tables that show which rules have been finalized and which remain under development.
The report also discusses factors that affect the timeframe in which regulations take effect, including statutory and judicial deadlines, public comment periods, judicial review, and permitting procedures, the net results of which are that existing facilities are likely to have several years before being required to comply with most of the regulatory actions under discussion. Unable to account for such factors, which will vary from case to case, timelines that show dates for proposal and promulgation of EPA standards effectively underestimate the complexities of the regulatory process and overstate the near-term impact of many of the regulatory actions.
I was in Sandiago California in 1971 -and you could not see the sky some times for the green air.!!!The air looked like you could put it in a jug.
The 112 -th-Congress with a -10 -approval rating should has the responsability to how this President accountable -To ad they have been on strike for the last few years.
Summary
Since Barack Obama was sworn in as President in 2009, the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has proposed and promulgated numerous regulations implementing the pollution control statutes enacted by Congress. Critics have reacted strongly. Many, both within Congress and outside of it, have accused the agency of reaching beyond the authority given it by Congress and ignoring or underestimating the costs and economic impacts of proposed and promulgated rules. The House has conducted vigorous oversight of the agency in the 112th Congress, and has approved several bills that would overturn specific regulations or limit the agency’s authority. Particular attention is being paid to the Clean Air Act, under which EPA has moved forward with the first federal controls on emissions of greenhouse gases and also addressed emissions of conventional pollutants from a number of industries.
Environmental groups and others disagree that the agency has overreached, and EPA states that critics’ focus on the cost of controls obscures the benefits of new regulations, which, it estimates, far exceed the costs; and it maintains that pollution control is an important source of economic activity, exports, and American jobs. Further, the agency and its supporters say that EPA is carrying out the mandates detailed by Congress in the federal environmental statutes.
This report provides background information on recent EPA regulatory activity to help address these issues. It examines 41 major or controversial regulatory actions taken by or under development at EPA since January 2009, providing details on the regulatory action itself, presenting an estimated timeline for completion of the rule (including identification of related court or statutory deadlines), and, in general, providing EPA’s estimates of costs and benefits, where available. The report includes tables that show which rules have been finalized and which remain under development.
The report also discusses factors that affect the timeframe in which regulations take effect, including statutory and judicial deadlines, public comment periods, judicial review, and permitting procedures, the net results of which are that existing facilities are likely to have several years before being required to comply with most of the regulatory actions under discussion. Unable to account for such factors, which will vary from case to case, timelines that show dates for proposal and promulgation of EPA standards effectively underestimate the complexities of the regulatory process and overstate the near-term impact of many of the regulatory actions.
If a man shuts his ears to the cry of the poor, he too will cry out and not be answered
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
What a clown pinemutt that you would use children beathing bad air vrs staving to death because dad has no job. But then I know you are about entitlements and goverment cheese, instead of jobs and men that want more for thier families that goverment control.
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Pine Mt Beagles
- Posts: 7803
- Joined: Wed May 11, 2005 6:01 pm
- Location: Pineville Ky
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
Top
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
by bluemouse » Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:25 am
What a clown pinemutt that you would use children beathing bad air vrs staving to death because dad has no job. But then I know you are about entitlements and goverment cheese, instead of jobs and men that want more for thier families that goverment control.
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-Bluemouse
As usual you don't know -what you are talking about-
I didn't say -Bad Air-vs-No Jobs What- I say is The Republicans -killed all of the Job's -about 650,000 a month- in 2008-and they attack the E P A -over trying to keep the air clean-Republican's -have horrable record's on both-But -Then it's hard to find some thing they are serious about EXCEPT TAX CUT'S--FOR THE ELITE-
Republicans -try to talk about Lowering -the national debt -But -They want to leave out tax cut's for the elite-subsides for Big Oil and Drug companies-the Military Budet------The only thing -they -will talk about -when they want to lower -the is national is cutting benefits to the poor --sick and Elderly mostly on Social Security-and more Tax on lower in come Workers.
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
by bluemouse » Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:25 am
What a clown pinemutt that you would use children beathing bad air vrs staving to death because dad has no job. But then I know you are about entitlements and goverment cheese, instead of jobs and men that want more for thier families that goverment control.
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-Bluemouse
As usual you don't know -what you are talking about-
I didn't say -Bad Air-vs-No Jobs What- I say is The Republicans -killed all of the Job's -about 650,000 a month- in 2008-and they attack the E P A -over trying to keep the air clean-Republican's -have horrable record's on both-But -Then it's hard to find some thing they are serious about EXCEPT TAX CUT'S--FOR THE ELITE-
Republicans -try to talk about Lowering -the national debt -But -They want to leave out tax cut's for the elite-subsides for Big Oil and Drug companies-the Military Budet------The only thing -they -will talk about -when they want to lower -the is national is cutting benefits to the poor --sick and Elderly mostly on Social Security-and more Tax on lower in come Workers.
If a man shuts his ears to the cry of the poor, he too will cry out and not be answered
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Rabbithoundjb
- Posts: 4517
- Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2006 4:30 pm
- Location: Rocky Mount, NC
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
Again PMB you blame republicans for the economic collapse which is a ball face lie. I have posted the entitlement legislation that caused the financial collapse numerous times and you have not been able to refute it, yet you repeat this same lie over and pver and over again. Pathetic ignorance to facts!
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
Just as I thought that you would use liberal logic, air quality control has been in place for decades now but obabblers job killing policies or coming home to roost. Got it.
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
There are more children dieing in abortion clinics than from breathing difficulties. Where is the love?
There are more children dieing from drug related accidents than from breathing polluted air. Why don't we close the border?
Obama in one of his off teleprompter responses said that it is the computer age that has reduced the number of available jobs. Why doesn't he control the border.
It appears that every action by this administration has been the result of its hatred for our way of life.
Give an example of his cure for any problem.
His foreign policy?
His economic policy?
His health policy?
His education policy?
His energy policy?
Race relations?
These are things that during the 08 campaign that he said he would fix.
Come on help me out.
There are more children dieing from drug related accidents than from breathing polluted air. Why don't we close the border?
Obama in one of his off teleprompter responses said that it is the computer age that has reduced the number of available jobs. Why doesn't he control the border.
It appears that every action by this administration has been the result of its hatred for our way of life.
Give an example of his cure for any problem.
His foreign policy?
His economic policy?
His health policy?
His education policy?
His energy policy?
Race relations?
These are things that during the 08 campaign that he said he would fix.
Come on help me out.
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Pine Mt Beagles
- Posts: 7803
- Joined: Wed May 11, 2005 6:01 pm
- Location: Pineville Ky
Re: Why Are Coal Plants Closing?
Abortion death's -are Republican -deaths-facts.
Entitlements -running wild also -Republican.
Both of these go up under Republican Presidents--
They deny Birth control -forcing higher abortion rates.
They kill job's -making more people -qualify for -Entitlements.
Plan and simple.
Entitlements -running wild also -Republican.
Both of these go up under Republican Presidents--
They deny Birth control -forcing higher abortion rates.
They kill job's -making more people -qualify for -Entitlements.
Plan and simple.
If a man shuts his ears to the cry of the poor, he too will cry out and not be answered