MYTH or FACT

[warddog]

I agree with Bunnyblaster in that when any of the things he alluded to get out of whack the population will be impacted, that's called nature and what I stated when I said it was all relevant. She has a way of balancing things out,naturally, but man is one that nature has no control over. As many have already stated when the populations are great, the predators are abundant and thriving on the food source available in the area. When the predators get so large in numbers that they deplete the food source they either move off that tract of land, reproduce less and or die. Sometimes nature inflicts disease to which many succumb to. When a tract of land has an abundant population of game many hunters know and hunt it unless it is privaye property with limited access to many. With that being said not all hunters hunt rabbits with dogs so that they get a run and many jump shoot them as they are rabbit hunters not beaglers. When we used to hunt state ground you could see about any type rabbit hunter you could think of, all legally hunting rabbits with or without beagles. I've seen them pull up to a tract in two vehicles with 6 to 8 hunters and tromp it just as if they were pushing deer, shooting anything and everything in their path from rabbits, squirrels, coyottes, quail and even tweety birds, without one dog among them. These types of legal hunters are in addition to those of us who hunt by giving game a fair chase. Each of these hunter don't care about fair chase, limits, or how populated the tract is they are there to shoot game and that they do. if they do good they will get some of their other buddies and come back at the next opportunity they get for more slaughtering fun as they could care less about tomorrow. If after a few trips they find no game to shoot at they move on to find another section and do the same.
I also agree with gwyoung as long as the above scenerio isn't what happens when others hunt a tract of land holding a good population of game as we can hunt it right but we have no control over how others hunt it.

[likeemfast]

yes, man is the ultimate predator only cuz we have a gun, but man does not impact the rabbit population as much as predation. That man does affect the deer population by shooting several doe in a area is a true statement. Out of all the predators i listed earlier that prey on rabbits, the coyote is basically the only one that will also prey on deer. So you have man and coyote hunting deer, and you have man and coyote and many many many other creatures taking rabbits. Ive seen crows take live baby rabbits out of a nest in a yard, they hop around your yard looking for a rabbit nest and then will clean it out. Never seen a crow take a young deer out of a nest. As gwyoung said earlier,..... my next statement may not be very popular but its the truth, THIS SHOULD NOT BE HARD FOR A PERSON WITH HALF A BRAIN TO UNDERSTAND. Basically any meat eating animal preys on a rabbit. You cant compare deer populations and rabbit populations as being done from the ultimate predator man, cuz NOWHERE AND I MEAN NOWHERE are the predation on the 2 of these anywhere near the same. Ive never heard a deer bah in the middle of the night cuz a owl flew out of a tree and grabbed it, or the same during the day cuz a hawk grabbed it, i have never seen a weasel take down a whitetail, or a possum take down a young whitetail in the nest. Yes deer and rabbit have some of the same animals who predate on them but the little old cottontail has so so so many more. For those of you guys who are going to post the you tube of a eagle taking a deer dont bother to combat my owl and hawk theory. So now that you hopefully understand the rabbit is the ULTIMATE MEAL for any carnivorous creature back to the real question. You can overhunt a area for cottontail, you can shoot more than you think you should, but dont even think you and your hounds are good enough to take the last rabbits out of an area and your foolish if you think your hunds are that good. I hunt areas in PA this day that you may get 1 or 2 jumps or even 0 three or four times straight and the 5th time i go there its non stop running with seeing rabbits running out of the chase that their not even on. Go back 2 days later and cant get a run. I hunt the same areas year after year and if i have 10 places to hunt, we will continuously take 80percent of our rabbits out of 30 percent of my hunting areas. Good habitat and feed and shoot all predators you see. dont compare deer and rabbit populations as equals because they are not. Look at the tailgate loads of bunnies JOEYMAN used to post. Great food and great cover and protection form the air cuz habitat is so thick, and hes posted those hunts for years and years.365 days a year those predators have to hunt and eat boys. You hunt a couple weeks and a lot of you that chimed in probably dont even gun hunt anymore cuz ur too lazy to go shoot some predators and think theres no rabbits. Im done, hopefully you learned something

[beaglerof4]

Wow this is a long post lol. All you need to do to control the preditors is start trapping them. I took 7 fox,1 coyote and 3 racoon all off from one of my propertys this season and all within 100 acres. I will say that i already am seeing more rabbits out when I drive up there in the dark and they seem to be alot more calm then before also. Here is a couple pictures of some big time rabbit eaters.

[pilotknob]

Good job beaglerof4!!!!You have the right idea man can also have an impact on the preaditor populations.I have taken up preaditor hunting myself.I havn't Hurt the populations much but it is alot of fun and hunting preaditors involves a whole new level of difficulty compared to anything else I have ever hunted.I believe a guy could do it his whole life and never quit learning.We had a small game wildlife bioligist from the Fish and Wildlife Dept.come speek at our beagle club meeting,He discribed rabbits and quail as terminal species.Meaning that they won't move to a new area if food and cover are not available they won't survive.He went on to say that a doe rabbit will spend her entier life on a 10 to 20 acer plot if she has the preper habitat...Less if it is really good.Buck rabbits will travel some looking for does.Then move on when there is no more to breed.In my area coyotes roam arround they set up in a area and when the food supply is gone they move on...Then they come back thru in 3 or 4 wks...If we as rabbit hunters put pressure on preaditors year round and did little things like pitching sime blocks of salt up into the thickets when we were out running dogs.Trying to improve habitat any way we can...A few cedars thrown into a fallen hard wood tree top makes a pretty good place to slow down a prusuer....Feb is the Mo.to sow clover just put it on the ground in clearings or places it can get sun. 2 or 3 pounds will make a bunch of small plots.If you can try to keep the plots away from good hunting trees for hawks and owls.Keep em rollen.

[warddog]

Man is the only predator that has a choice of what they kill and outside of the balance of nature. Most other predators do so to eat and survive not for the sport of it although some will kill just to kill such as cats. I think the comparison of deer to rabbit hunting did exactly what I intended it to do and that was to show that even those species that have no real natural predators can have populations impacted by man alone. What man kills is in addition to what all other predators take as well and the original question was does hunting impact numbers more than predators. To even bolster my opinion take a look at the video on here of Hog Hunting Texas Style! Looks to me like jump shooting has a pretty drastic impact on those hog numbers. Can't hardly deny what meets the eye. Again, we have an animal with little predation upon it and that's why their numbers have grown so how will the population be demished.........MAN......and he doesn't even have to compete with coyotes, hawks, eagles, ferrel cats or any other predator as he is the lone ranger doing the population demishing. In this case it appears to be only a hunter or two. People will try to make the case that it isn't hunting but there are many posts below it of people wanting to sign up for that very hunting trip in the chopper. Yep that's alot of bacon and I hope they load them not only on the tail gate but in several truck loads and feed a bunch of needy folks with it. By-the-way according to what I read this is also legal hunting!

[Lee Cockman]

Let me say some people are IDIOTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
GO RUN DOGS BEFORE YOU HAVE A HEARTATTACK worring about what man takes in a season. Dont be a hater!!!!!!!!!!!!! Last post I will make on the matter so post what you feel makes you happy Write a page or so on the matter I am sure you have time!!!!!!!!

[snowhound]

It is mostly about habitat and the health of the rabbits simply comes from that.
We have just gone through the down turn cycle of rabbits, even though we try and manage it as well as we can.
We push bush down during the winter with a dozer, so the rabbits have the bark of the poplars to eat ( which they do unbelievably a lot), and allows the thicker, younger underbrush and trees to grow back during the summer.
By doing this we have managed it and are not without rabbits any more at all. There still is a regular downturn in the hare though. By "walking" the dozer through the bush and leaving the deadfall as it is, it also makes it a heck of a lot more difficult for the predators. ( we have coyotes, fishers, timbers, etc.). We don't allow the 2 legged kind on our land to shoot rabbits.
If the trees etc. are too mature, and there is nothing for the hare / rabbits to eat, obviously they are die off or move on. I.E. manage the habitat and changes are you'll have steady rabbits.
We have also read many years back that the hare needs the tannins in the bark to stay healthy.
Hope this helps.
Frieda Krpan

[Done Gone Beagles]

I have 6 beagles and in the last few years I have found that the rabbit population has deminish and all of the rabbit hunters say the same that I have talk too. I have found myself driving farther for rabbit than before