A general forum for the discussion of hunting with beagles, guns, clothing and other equipment and just talking dawgs! (Tall tales on hunting allowed, but remember, first liar doesn't stand a chance)
Post by Newt » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:31 pm
Thirty years ago, the gundog movement was fairly new. You could compete with some success the same dog in LPH, SPO Midwest, SPO Deep South, and rabbit hunt. Try that today.
There are a lot of "good dogs" today but you have to know which niche the dogs fit.
Newt I say tell me what niche that bad to the bone is in. because thats where i want to compete at
I hunt frontend rabbit minded dogs.. i wont settle for anything less.. im actually lookin for a nice young male dog.. but dont ask me more for him then i will take for mine unless you can beat me....
Northern hare posted:
"These people sell these litters to unsuspecting customers"
Northernhare, how in the wide world of sports do you get this done with a set of pedigree papers????
For the folks that want a real wake up call about linebreeding and inbreeding...I say check out throbred horse and cattle.pedigree,,,..Not for the faint of heart.
Seelow makes this post -"The best dog I've ever hunted with came from a trade day when was about 3 months old. He was a year old before he ever ran his first track. Sometimes I think they are like people. More famous after they are gone. But the dogs then would definitely beat those of today.. I would like to hear other opinions on why.
Just my opinion. Rabbits were in greater numbers because "clean farming" was not practiced. Any predator that preyed on chickens or farm fowl was fair game for farmers and hunters alike. A feral house cat was shot on sight and there was plenty of places to hunt because no one posted their land. Fences did not mean "keep out" to hunters, you only had to crawl through the fence and continue to hunt. Just do not climb on the fence or leave a gate open. Most did not have registered or even pure bred Beagles, but hound mixed or what was called a "bench legged fiest'. As a kid, my rabbit dogs were Red Bone hounds normally used as treeing dogs. Those were the days of meat dogs, if it could not or would not bring the bunny to the gun, it was culled, 12 gauge style. Many hunters, farmers especially, had lots of time to hunt during the winter months which provided a source of food. Dogs were never kenneled, but were free to chase rabbits all year long and thereby became better rabbit dogs. No one ever tried to sell a dog but may trade one or simlpy give it to a neighbor who would hunt and care for it.
That sounds like the way it was around hear in east ky Bill. You never heard of a coyote when I was a boy. And you where aloud to dispose of cats. I agree I think the rabbit population is definitely down
For the folks that want a real wake up call about linebreeding and inbreeding...I say check out throbred horse
Dave they wont generally breed a race horse within 4 generations now. They are so suseptable to injury now that its unheard of to complete the triple crown. I just read an article last week that the expert breeders for one of the top stud horses are struggling to find a horse that isn't too closely related. Inbreeding is out with horses.
Mybeagles
Rob’s Ranger Rabbit Hunter (Lefty)
Rose City Quad King’s
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Its a Long Way To The Top If Ya Wanna Rock And Roll. Bottom line is when and if you find something that yanks your crank, ya better buy into it and start a family. Good dogs are out there but i still think that watching asking and preparing is the main thing when looking.I just turned 49 and not afraid to ask questions to those i fill know more than me. Having a open mind when venturing on the journey certainly helps.
I know mine aint the best but after several years of maintaning what i like with a outcross or two certainly put me on the right track. Wether we are chasing trophies or rabbits the main focus i have kept is a dog that will hunt and circle a rabbit as quick as conditions allow. The rest is just fine tuning and icing on the cake.I could of easily married a skank but chose a nurse.
When the moment of truth arrives, the point of preparation has passed.
Old School, Full Throttle ,No Bottle.
I'm satisfied with the dogs I run. I hope I can always maintain a similar stock. I haven't been in this as long as a lot of folks but I've seen a couple comments I think I should respond to. First someone said, today's dogs aren't as good as our yard dogs use to be. This could be in part because dogs that can be left out and run at will can reach their full potential. The price of a dog is too high.... I was told once as a child that collecting baseball cards, it doesn't matter what a Beckett prices a card at, it's only worth what someone will pay for it. That being said....if you give too much for a dog....it's your own darn fault. We as people have manipulated the breeding of dogs to get a desired outcome. We can change it, just don't expect anyone to do it for you. Jmo.
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when ther are a plenty of rabbits your hounds look alot better you find out what kind a dog you have when the rabbits are scarce but it sure makes a good excuse for us to use I have one place that is loaded with rabbits and got another a guy quit huntin because ' he said' no rabbits but i hadnt had any problem
Neil, I think see lows statement about yard dogs was not ment literly, what he was saying was the quality of dogs back then seemed to be better. Now it seems if they are breed right or have POTENTIAL or they do well as a pack well thats good enough for some people. And I don' t think that anybody thinks a GOOD DOG isn't worth alot of money. But the price doesn't make the dog. To often I think people pay big money for a dog based on potential, bloodline,and sires accomplishments and not the actual quality of the dog.All the POTENTIAL in the world won't do anything for me unless that dog does it consisstently. JMO
Un -fortunatley some are consistant at being nothing . Other than a overpriced cull. I still say A worthy stud can not overcome a worthless bitch and would go a step further keep on watching the for sale section its a coming. I have turned down a few bitches for the simple reason they were not worth killing my studs name for a few hundred bucks. But to each there own. I have seen some tell all of us about awesome hunt awesome mouth and tons of bottom. Well i have seen em at the hunts yea right, my advice to anyone is watch this board the traders are here and they all got the best, figure out whos who before buying anything. What happened to the good ol days when we watched dogs run and didnt buy off word of mouth?
When the moment of truth arrives, the point of preparation has passed.
Old School, Full Throttle ,No Bottle.
Maple Valley said, "What happened to the good ol days when we watched dogs run and didnt buy off word of mouth?". I'll tell you what happened: we live in the age of the inter-net. It has opened everything up to people who know little about dogs to buy off people who know less but are good salesman. Trust me, I have bought more than my share.
Also, it is difficult to run with a man's dogs when you live hundreds of miles away. In Kentucky, there seems to be all kinds of dogs for sale and they are a lot of them spaced rather close together. In Michigan, we don't have the number of beagle hunters due to many factors. It is hard to run when people are so far apart so, this lends itself to listening to pedigree salesman who paint a very good picture until you see it in the woods.
If a man is willing to give you a trial period, what can you lose. You try the dog, if you like it, it is yours. If you do not get a trial, run the other way. If a dog leaves my place, a person absolutely must be satisfied. As in the case of Augerhead, he tried the 4 digit dog for a week when the price was down real low, it didn't suit him so he brought it back. No fuss, no muss. When you sell a man a dog, you should be making a friend as well as a customer.JMO
I have met some quality people on this board and I have met some that are real slippery. Either way, if I buy a dog, it is on me. My responsibility. Quick story, I bought a dog off a man 10 days ago. When I grabbed hold of it to take it hunting, it went wild. Attacked me real hard, caused great consternation and doctor bills. The man that I got it from offered my money back but I said No. That was my dog when I bought it and it died my dog. I never asked him if it was a fighter.
augerhead wrote: By the way try to find a dog that will hunt hard in the cover where the rabbits are thin, and do it all the time no matter how hot, how thick,how cold,ect. not many in the last few years that I've seen.
True statement period. I currently own 1 that meets that criteria and am always looking for another. She is the only one I've ever had that meets that criteria 100% of the time.
Neilkimbrel7 say's I'm satisfied with the dogs I run. I hope I can always maintain a similar stock. I haven't been in this as long as a lot of folks but I've seen a couple comments I think I should respond to. First someone said, today's dogs aren't as good as our yard dogs use to be. This could be in part because dogs that can be left out and run at will can reach their full potential. The price of a dog is too high.... I was told once as a child that collecting baseball cards, it doesn't matter what a Beckett prices a card at, it's only worth what someone will pay for it. That being said....if you give too much for a dog....it's your own darn fault. We as people have manipulated the breeding of dogs to get a desired outcome. We can change it, just don't expect anyone to do it for you. Jmo. When i say yard dogs i mean a beagle that we didnt find worthy enough to take to the woods and hunt..Wether it be cuz it was to slow, couldnt run a good enough rabbit, didnt hunt quite hard enough the list goes on and on... I have saw people pull up and ask... " how much for that one, he looks like he'll run" the reply would ussually be.. what will ya give? he aint worth much , if he was he would be tied up... and a trade was ussually made on a pocketknife or somethin.. What im sayin is people know if a dog is standing around.. that means IT DONT HUNT RIGHT.. or if it cant run a rabbit.. stop tryin to sale the culls.... there should be a certain criteria that a dog over a year old has to meet before it can even be on the beagler... If that was the case people wouldnt be gettin eat up by crazy dogs.. and other sickening factors about dogs wouldnt even be an issue... JMO
