no more oversized dogs

[raccoon crk kennel]

i just dont see the big deal,how does a fourth of an inch or so help a dog anyways? if a hound thats right on 15in goes against one 15.25 is that .25 of an inch what beat that 15in dog? i dont think so! maybe the judges should be measured,wieghed and put threw a physical as well as made sure of by inspecters that they can stay on the hounds to get every score on the hound then! theres alot of issues besides the size of a dog that gets you beat or causes you to win than the size of your hound! i agree the rule is the rule and a 16 or 17in hound should be disquilified but as close as .25?

[bucks better beagles]

Raccoon Crk: As usual I can see your point but the issue here, I think is bigger than who has the best dog. It is the breed itself. The trialers are the people that set the standards for the rest of us. Like it or not, I will take a well bred dog over a grade dog anytime if I can. That said, we must keep the size of the beagle at the standard or where do you stop. They are supposed to be 15" than that is the way it is, like it or not.

As rules go, I live in a glass house so I try not to say what is right or wrong but the standard is an important issue.

[bwe007]

the rule says 15" period thats it not 15 1/8" but 15". if your dog is over 15" tuff cookies it's out. there is not any format that allows hounds over 15". not akc not ukc not ckc not nkc. quit your crying and run your dogs in the trials that are 15" or under. what's so hard about that? and as far as letting 15.25" hounds in well why not 15.5" why there only a 1/4 inch taller and for that matter why not 15.75" and 16" and 16.25" and 16.5" and 16.75" and 17" i hope you all see where this is going.

[cjones]

the rule says 15" period thats it not 15 1/8" but 15". if your dog is over 15" tuff cookies it's out. there is not any format that allows hounds over 15". not akc not ukc not ckc not nkc. quit your crying and run your dogs in the trials that are 15" or under. what's so hard about that? and as far as letting 15.25" hounds in well why not 15.5" why there only a 1/4 inch taller and for that matter why not 15.75" and 16" and 16.25" and 16.5" and 16.75" and 17" i hope you all see where this is going.

ARHA big pack allows up to 16"!!

[raccoon crk kennel]

the rule says 15" period thats it not 15 1/8" but 15". if your dog is over 15" tuff cookies it's out. there is not any format that allows hounds over 15". not akc not ukc not ckc not nkc. quit your crying and run your dogs in the trials that are 15" or under. what's so hard about that? and as far as letting 15.25" hounds in well why not 15.5" why there only a 1/4 inch taller and for that matter why not 15.75" and 16" and 16.25" and 16.5" and 16.75" and 17" i hope you all see where this is going.

ARHA big pack allows up to 16"!!

i agree with you to an exstent but there needs to be a buffer zone there, am not saying run 15.5,16.0 thats blatant you know before you ever put alot of time in a pup that it is going to get that big that hes going over,the 15.25 in my belief should be like a, thats it give you the benifit of the dought cushion cause every inspecter measures difrent and that same dog will stand 3 difrant ways the same day under the stand. ive seen alot of hound come out of sires and dams no were near 15 and 3 gen back didnt have a dog over,throw a oversize hound know and then its just such a bad deal,i know any true beagler can tell when their pup is 6m old if hes going to go over bad,but when you get one that you mesure and is fine then start training your azz off on this hound and he goes over by any at all that just not right. the big 15.5 in and up a person would be lying to theirself to look at him as a pup and say he isnt going over. i say keep the 15in rule inplace but alow .25 of a cushion cause every inspecter is going to mesure difrent

[raccoon crk kennel]

the rule says 15" period thats it not 15 1/8" but 15". if your dog is over 15" tuff cookies it's out. there is not any format that allows hounds over 15". not akc not ukc not ckc not nkc. quit your crying and run your dogs in the trials that are 15" or under. what's so hard about that? and as far as letting 15.25" hounds in well why not 15.5" why there only a 1/4 inch taller and for that matter why not 15.75" and 16" and 16.25" and 16.5" and 16.75" and 17" i hope you all see where this is going.

ARHA big pack allows up to 16"!!

i agree with you to an exstent but there needs to be a buffer zone there, am not saying run 15.5,16.0 thats blatant you know before you ever put alot of time in a pup that it is going to get that big that hes going over,the 15.25 in my belief should be like a, thats it give you the benifit of the dought cushion cause every inspecter measures difrent and that same dog will stand 3 difrant ways the same day under the stand. ive seen alot of hound come out of sires and dams no were near 15 and 3 gen back didnt have a dog over,throw a oversize hound know and then its just such a bad deal,i know any true beagler can tell when their pup is 6m old if hes going to go over bad,but when you get one that you mesure and is fine then start training your azz off on this hound and he goes over by any at all that just not right. the big 15.5 in and up a person would be lying to theirself to look at him as a pup and say he isnt going over. i say keep the 15in rule inplace but alow .25 of a cushion cause every inspecter is going to mesure difrent

[Bunnyblaster]

You know I hear most guys get on here and talk about how they just love to hear the music. Trialing is something they love to do but it's just raising a good beagle that they get the most pleasure out of. Then I see someone get on here and talk about how they "wasted" so much time on a GREAT dog that went 15 1/2" when it was all said and done. IMO if you think all that time was a waste then you're in this for the wrong reason. Is it only about being able to win a trophy? If so then I guess I can see where you would think it was all wasted time. I can most definitely see where it would be a huge disappointment to have that happen but it's not like you can't run rabbits with the dog. Or breed it like some others have said to try to pass on a few of those GREAT traits while trying to control the size issue.

I guess I just don't get it, when did winning a trial become the most important part of running beagles?

And as far as for breaking the rules just a little bit goes.......it's still breaking the rules. I have yet to see anyone get on here and claim to be a saint, we all do wrong. But I'll tell you like I tell my kids wrong is wrong regardless of how many other people you see do it. And using that as a justification generally just makes you feel better about yourself.

[raccoon crk kennel]

You know I hear most guys get on here and talk about how they just love to hear the music. Trialing is something they love to do but it's just raising a good beagle that they get the most pleasure out of. Then I see someone get on here and talk about how they "wasted" so much time on a GREAT dog that went 15 1/2" when it was all said and done. IMO if you think all that time was a waste then you're in this for the wrong reason. Is it only about being able to win a trophy? If so then I guess I can see where you would think it was all wasted time. I can most definitely see where it would be a huge disappointment to have that happen but it's not like you can't run rabbits with the dog. Or breed it like some others have said to try to pass on a few of those GREAT traits while trying to control the size issue.

I guess I just don't get it, when did winning a trial become the most important part of running beagles?

And as far as for breaking the rules just a little bit goes.......it's still breaking the rules. I have yet to see anyone get on here and claim to be a saint, we all do wrong. But I'll tell you like I tell my kids wrong is wrong regardless of how many other people you see do it. And using that as a justification generally just makes you feel better about yourself.

to me and alot of others we raise,train dogs for trialing not to necessarly (win the trophy), you yourself said you seen on hear were SOME people says they just love to hear the music,theres also alot of us that loves to trial! and were the ones saying its a big waiste of time when one goes over! you can run rabbits with them,breed them and whatever but if you breed an oversized dog guiess what? you going to get more over sized dogs!

[raccoon crk kennel]

You know I hear most guys get on here and talk about how they just love to hear the music. Trialing is something they love to do but it's just raising a good beagle that they get the most pleasure out of. Then I see someone get on here and talk about how they "wasted" so much time on a GREAT dog that went 15 1/2" when it was all said and done. IMO if you think all that time was a waste then you're in this for the wrong reason. Is it only about being able to win a trophy? If so then I guess I can see where you would think it was all wasted time. I can most definitely see where it would be a huge disappointment to have that happen but it's not like you can't run rabbits with the dog. Or breed it like some others have said to try to pass on a few of those GREAT traits while trying to control the size issue.

I guess I just don't get it, when did winning a trial become the most important part of running beagles?

And as far as for breaking the rules just a little bit goes.......it's still breaking the rules. I have yet to see anyone get on here and claim to be a saint, we all do wrong. But I'll tell you like I tell my kids wrong is wrong regardless of how many other people you see do it. And using that as a justification generally just makes you feel better about yourself.

to me and alot of others we raise,train dogs for trialing not to necessarly (win the trophy), you yourself said you seen on hear were SOME people says they just love to hear the music,theres also alot of us that loves to trial! and were the ones saying its a big waiste of time when one goes over! you can run rabbits with them,breed them and whatever but if you breed an oversized dog guiess what? you going to get more over sized dogs!

[TC]

but if you breed an oversized dog guiess what? you going to get more over sized dogs!

Not necessarily i KNOW one bitch that has thrown a few oversized pups BUT none of those pups in 3 (Three) generations have EVER thrown anything over
14" 1/2 I Know this for a FACT
I OVERSIZED MALE from FIRST litter Bred 2x to a 13" bitch 5 pups all just over 13" but none over 14" 2nd time to a 14 inch bitch 6 pups None over 14 1/2
2 over 15" females from second and third breeding of this bitch 1st bred 3 times NONE over 15"
2nd bred 1 time all pups were 13" and she was bred to a 15" Male HOPING to get BIGGER MALES
The Bitch I am Talking about is a 13" and she has Thrown ONE pup from Every litter that went over but NONE of those pups have EVER thrown Anything over.
It is Just a Matter of KNOWING WHAT you are breeding to...
i Have NEVER had a Problem Getting Rid of Any oversized Dogs and two of the Males like i have Said I kept GREAT RABBIT dogs but then again I Like a Good Rabbit Dog I Just Dont trial em when they go Over...

[Bunnyblaster]

Ok but if you choose to run larger dogs then don't you already know this going into it? So who should you be upset with? The guys that wrote the rules? The guys that enforce the rules? The guys that call you out for not playing by the rules? Or yourself if you choose to try to get away with breaking the rules? Again, you may not think it's a big deal but the guy that did leave his 15 1/2" dog at home in the kennel probably does.

I do understand your explanation about the love of trialing though. I don't personally look at it that way but I understand your point about loving the trials for the trial itself and the opportunity to compete.

[toldyouso]

listen two things one is has there ever been a dog challenged on the bench answer no. Is this not where the standard should be up held the bench show is where your breeders are striving to put a product in the market if we all agree big ears straight legs lenth of a dogs tail and the standard size of a beagle should not exceed 15. That said i have seen judges mesurer tails ears over look bobbed tails which is a fault of a beagle but never ever have i seen a mesurer stand brought out at a bench show. If that is not two faced then what is. Why has their not ever been a protest on a bench show a dog at the world this year won with a under bite and this is promoting your breed standard. Listen if u want to fix it fix it but do not do it halfass. Idea after a dog hits 18 months have him offially mesured if that dog goes over stripe his papers refund the registration money to the owner and do not allow that dog to breed in your registration. Its that easy period. You said lets take a roll call on this question about rather people would vote rather a big dog should be in or out. That will not happen because it is only a hand full of people bitching. Their imporant people in the organization but not many so do not worry they will not give you a vote. I can guarantee that. Now that i have showed you how to fix it i Will tell you why it will not get fix MONEY MONEY MONEY buy your card spend your money and you will still be challenged at the stake. Someone still will bitch and you will be out what ever they charge you for your card. But ha u will have a card not worht nothing but u have one. The only stand you can use is only made by one man Chip do you think he is going to make out like a bandit. Once again it is not about the hound it is about the Money. Believe it!!!!!!!!!!

[RunninHard]

I am not a trailer but why dont they make a 15"+ class ?
From what I understand they have a 13" and 15" class, Right ?
So why not make a 15" and over class ? Just wondering
If they did this they could get more entry's and make more money,Also make all dogs legal/fair, Right ?
If trailers entered in the 15"/over class then they would/should know/Assume that they are most likely going to run against some bigger/taller dogs
Just like entering a 13 1/2 " dog or 14" dog in the 15" Class, In which they would be to big/Tall for the 13" Class, So there for you would assume to run against lager 15" dogs
Correct me if I am wrong, Like I said I am not a Trailer but somewhat get the idea (I think...lol)
I did not read every post in this thread so if this was already mentioned then disregard it

[raccoon crk kennel]

I am not a trailer but why dont they make a 15"+ class ?
From what I understand they have a 13" and 15" class, Right ?
So why not make a 15" and over class ? Just wondering
If they did this they could get more entry's and make more money,Also make all dogs legal/fair, Right ?
If trailers entered in the 15"/over class then they would/should know/Assume that they are most likely going to run against some bigger/taller dogs
Just like entering a 13 1/2 " dog or 14" dog in the 15" Class, In which they would be to big/Tall for the 13" Class, So there for you would assume to run against lager 15" dogs
Correct me if I am wrong, Like I said I am not a Trailer but somewhat get the idea (I think...lol)
I did not read every post in this thread so if this was already mentioned then disregard it

i agree!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

[mybeagles]

Create a new class of 15-17" so guys could bring a 17.5" because "its a waste of time" to train a dog and have it go over and not be able to trial it.

I'm sure some of you are aware they have night hunts.....they just run different game. No size limits either.

Mybeagles