no more oversized dogs

[hurryup]

This is an old discussion..If you got a 15 inch dog that kicks ass, somebody is gonna complain.. If you bring it to 10 hunts, it measures in 9 times and out 1 does that make ya a cheater. No, it means we all measure different. Sure there are some dogs a little over. That little bit isn't gonna matter. Its the heart and brains that win hunts not the length of their legs.. If you think a dog in your pack is to big ask to have it measured watch them do it and then hunt. Its over..I sure wouldn't come on here and embaress myself saying I lost because a big dog beat me, be honest with your self, ya got beat, we all do.

PS.. IDONOTBITCHSLAPIGNORANTAZZHILLBILLYS..Like the new signature Jimmy..

[toldyouso]

you are right patty is not that big but she has heart and thats all that matters.Listen i understand why we are in the middle east but do you really believe you are comparing to what you are doing to a rule about mesurering dogs. WOW thats a reach and in its own way a little radical. But i am not going to get into that discussion with you. I was in the military to not for long but long enough to know that you as a solidier are payed to do what you are told by your superiors I believe thats in your genernal orders. And if the organization was run like a democracy instead of a dictership where we can vote on rule changes like we use to then we could maybe fix our problems through discussion just like this. If you have a better way to do something or disagree with an order what do you do. See where i am going with this apples to oranges. Rules are Rules i agree but not all rules are good rules there just rules.

[mybeagles]

Greg,

You wouldn't be upset if you drove 6 hours one way for a trial and got measured out in the winners back by 1/4"? I saw two dogs get measured out in the winners pack this past weekend and I can assure you they were not very happy......I will say neither one of them said a word, and to my knowledge took it in stride.....

I always worry my dogs will be too big, and then I get to the trial and realize my dogs are the smallest by an inch or more.......for some reason my dogs seem to always stand real proud, so my 11.5-12" females measure 12.75....

Mybeagles

[jimb1069]

tolduso,

Don't worry about disagrements; it doesn't bother me. Its what helps us get both sides of the coin......

I think there is a case to be made for a 15"-17" class, but not in the 15" and under class. Guys running in deep snow all winter prefer the bigger hounds.

Don't think this will ever be solved. There are people in life that abide by the rules and those that don't. Thats why we have large penitentiaries all over the country. The enforcement of rules is what separates the US from Arab nations.....It's why we have 100,000 soldiers in Afghanistan, because no one here really cares about the "RULES".

Mybeagles

mybeagles,

First I would like to say thanks for your service! Adding another class in the same format would only add argument to which class of hounds were truly the better dogs. From what I see we have enough of that just between the different registries. I agree with you on abiding by the rules but not everyone is like yourself and walks the direction he is told just simply because the man told him to walk that direction. Some of us question why or why not,not for the simple fact of arguing but that another perspective on the matter never hurts. Simply comparing guys running oversize hounds to terrorists in Afghanistan is absurd. You put yourself up pretty highly on this rule breaking issue. To that I ask, have you never rolled through a stop sign? Sounds as silly to ask that question as it is to down grade someone for running a dog that grew to much for your liking. These are rules to running a hound, truly not as important as the BIG 10 rules.

[mybeagles]

Every country in the world worth living in enforces laws. All the countries that don't, live in utter confusion. I'm not trying to compare an oversize dog to terrorist, Im saying we shun the very thing that makes our country great. Rules and order.....

If you talk to a man in prison he will tell you he started out with little crimes and it escalated.

Oversize dogs might not seem like a big deal.......others dont feel switching papers on a litter of pups is a big deal......and as we have seen lately, some dont seem to think its a big deal to steal someones dogs out of a persons kennel......animal rights people think its ok to release all the zoo animals.....the crack head thinks its ok to steal an old ladies purse to buy drugs.......Afghani's think its ok to kill Americans because were infidels.......Bottom line, rule/law breakers never think what they are doing is "that bad"

Its all perspective......I choose not to start down that road......others think they can break rules but will know when to draw the line......I don't trust myself.....obviously some didn't know where to stop......Im glad some of you have the will to break some rules, but not the BIG ones.....

Have I ever rolled through a stop sign? Yep, but I try to put myself in check and stop before I end up speeding through a stop sign and getting someone killed. I make an effort not to break rules and laws. When I do, I correct it. Knowingly breaking rules/laws and getting comfortable with it is a slippery slope I hope to never get on........

Mybeagles

Mybeagles

[Greg Wells]

Yeah, I'm human. I would be upset , but that's the chance I take. I always hated measuring dogs when I judged. There is no exact science to it & you hate to see one of your best scoring hounds of the day measure over especially when there are some in the class just as big or bigger that are officially measured & knowing also that that extra size didn't help the dog work out those tough checks. I have measured the same hounds in & out over the years, so I know they don't always stand the same or will measure the same everytime. You don't know how it feels until you're put in that position. It's easy to sit back like some of these guys & think it's cut & dry on what a dog will measure. That just tells me that they haven't been there & measured very many hounds.

[jimb1069]

I think I will be able to live with myself if I try to run an oversize dog. If I get measured so be it. But I cant agree with you totally on what makes this a great country. A big part of what made it great was our Fore fathers saying "that's enough, we don't agree" and they voiced their opinion and made changes. Same as this issue, I am sure when the sport of beagles began there weren't many dogs 15inches. So they set that as a standard of how big was big enough. Now days 15 and over dogs are common due to breeding practices. So do we continue to live by yesterdays rules or do we take a look and decide if its time for a change or enforce it to the letter just to keep the standard. Kinda like speed limits increasing with better cars on the road.

[MGB]

I don't care if you want to bring a coon dog.It still has to have hunt,nose,and brains. You know it's over and so does everybody else.I care that your buddy's giving you checks that your dog didn't get and the BEST DOG DOESN'T WIN more time than not.

[toldyouso]

The question is do we try and mesurer dogs out or do we try to mesurer dogs in. AKC they try to get the dog in NKC do everything in their power when mesurer dogs to get them out.

[Ohiohntr]

Yeah, I'm human. I would be upset , but that's the chance I take. I always hated measuring dogs when I judged. There is no exact science to it & you hate to see one of your best scoring hounds of the day measure over especially when there are some in the class just as big or bigger that are officially measured & knowing also that that extra size didn't help the dog work out those tough checks. I have measured the same hounds in & out over the years, so I know they don't always stand the same or will measure the same everytime. You don't know how it feels until you're put in that position. It's easy to sit back like some of these guys & think it's cut & dry on what a dog will measure. That just tells me that they haven't been there & measured very many hounds.

Good Post Greg.....to me measuring is the worst part of judging...I hate it!! I premeasured 11 females recently and 6 of them measured 13 1/2" on the dot...all right in a row....and another was 13 3/4"....it makes you as a judge feel like a real tool calling out 7 dogs, but it is what it is. My thinking at the time while guys were grumbling around....if the guys didn't think they were close, they never would have premeasured. After the first few dogs and hearing the background comments I started turning the stand to the other judge for him to read it as well.

No judge ever wants to measure a dog out of his winners pack after chasing the dog all day and knowing that 1/2" didn't help that dog at all....again, it is what it is and this is the system AKC has put forth for us to use. Yes, it sure sucks for the owners to drive home knowing that the last trial it measured in and this one it measured out. As a judge I can't help what the judges did last week and can only control this week....Did they stand him different? Did they read the stick wrong? Did they let him slide? These are all things that can happen and it makes the judges measuring and reading it right look like buttheads.

Frank- You call out the dogs measurement based on what the stand says after you pose the dog via the rule book...point blank

[Spruce Ridge Beagler]

I wonder how many dogs are gonna be up for sale in 2012 ?
Is there really gonna be a charge to have your dog officially measured ? If so, did they say how much ?
I think the official measurement card is just gonna bring it right back to where it is now, leaving it up to handlers to call dogs out at the stake, only difference is that NKC will have lined their pockets once again.

[mybeagles]

A big part of what made it great was our Fore fathers saying "that's enough, we don't agree" and they voiced their opinion and made changes.

I think thats called the Constitution (rules/laws)....the more we ammend it the worse off we will be.....

For example....you cant kill babies unless......you cant own a gun unless.......you cant run an oversize dog unless.....people dont care about the rules.

Greg,

I have to agree....whats bad is when you measure a dog out and the dog walks next to it that you measured in and its an inch taller........

Ive seen guys hitting dogs with a leather strap before measurement to ensure they wont stand tall......guys with blatant oversize really put the judges in a perdicament when they wont stand.......

Mybeagles

[Joeyman]

Isn't the rule you can have your dog measured 3 times during the measurement process?

if he measures over once and under twice well......

[wildcatfan0309]

Whats this got to do with me buddy? You are the one running everything in lp down , and Blairs family also ? Bet ya didnt know his mom is a cancer survivor huh? Maybe chads right, ya need to get the hell out that hollar sometimes. So really i dont have a dog in this fight, as far as that azz whoppin ya keep running dat mouth on here somebody will take ya up on it. I dont fight no more but i will make a exception when provoked. As far as your comment towards me.Its dust in the wind.

geeeezzz
there aint nobody gonna fight over a stupid argument on this board surely
and beside if they did fight over it me , maple valley kennels and sevrel others would have gotten our mouths busted along time ago

Good point Josh i have been known to get too jacked up on Mt.Dew and speak my mind though.

yeah me too

[Bunnyblaster]

8 pages.........really???

This gets brought up at least once a year and it's always the same old argument on both sides. Bottom line is rules are rules and if your dog measures out then take it and leave. Or better yet stay and watch the trial and just enjoy yourself. I agree with the fact that an inch of height isn't gonna win or lose a trial but there has to be a cutoff somewhere. So if the rules say 15" but some guys think it's ok to stretch it then how far is too far? 15 1/2"?? 16"?? Ooooh, maybe we should just take the breed standard completely out so there is nothing they have to conform to in order to be considered a beagle? A better dog is a better dog whether it's a beagle a yorkie or a stinking labradoodle but if you're gonna compete in a licensed event with rules then don't complain when they get enforced.

On another note I think baseball players should be able to use steroids, but just a little. I mean it's not like a little bit here and there is gonna make a real difference............or at least that's probably what they tell themselves while their shooting up.

Look there is always gonna be someone that tries to "stretch" the rules but stretch is just another word for break. And it doesn't mean we should always change them to accommodate individuals because once it starts then where does it stop?

Let it go and take that oversized dog on a rabbit hunt. If he's good enough to try to squeeze him into a trial then you'd probably have more funny shooting a tailgate full of bunnies over him anyhow.