looking for stud/bloodline w/tons of hunt

[gfedor]

I got intouch with the orginal breeder of my line. He had a fc stud , kalagha,ranger dan, sals coco in ped, going to see run.

[S.R.Patch]

Yeah, it's amazing how A.D.Holcombe writings and Jim's thinking are so much alike,...why, you'd think they was the same person...

Copywright laws stink.

Yea, I have borrowed a few of A.D. Holcombe books from Jim along with several other books. He has a collection like none other concerning hounds in general. But I do believe he is more engrossed with the actual writings of the actual writers that provided the “material” of the books, not the spell checkers, re-writers and the people that put the book together.

You read the books? Or do you care to expand on your comments? Do you not like A.D. Holcombe, or do you not like Jim? I am not sure some of us know which direction your “slam” was intended, or why? It went from talking about hard hunting dogs to the comments you made that had nothing to do with the subject at hand.

I don't think AD "rewrote" anything or was a "spell checker" for any body, He went directly to the source to get the story and used individual thought material, "not" copy/past, with a few "In my opinions" to claim ownership . It's the re-writers that have those troubles with the copyright laws is all I'm say'n...
No slam or argument, the truth will bare itself out... ... and I'm sure Jim has some fine hounds.

[Dr. Chris]

I don't think AD "rewrote" anything or was a "spell checker" for any body, He went directly to the source to get the story and used individual thought material, "not" copy/past, with a few "In my opinions" to claim ownership . It's the re-writers that have those troubles with the copyright laws is all I'm say'n...
No slam or argument, the truth will bare itself out... ... and I'm sure Jim has some fine hounds.

Sure AD did, along with many other people. Know anything at all about writing? AD took another man’s story, re-wrote it, backed it with facts, writings and quotes from several different earlier previous writings, and mixed in his personal opinions and twists. Nothing wrong with it, that’s the way it is done. As of a matter of fact, in the front of every one of his books he gives a legal right for others to do just that, they can use his material to “re-print” and publish, but not for the sake of profit. He allowed it, because he did it. Along with many others. Rev. John Parks has written some great articles, but he greatly used and quoted AD and others word for word and added his own opinions of the subject and created some great articles that many have tucked away and saved to this day. Nothing wrong with it, that is the way it is done. Not really much is “original”, people can only tell the same story about the same subject in a limited amount of ways without repeating, quoting and sounding a lot like each other.

But if you are attempting to cast a shadow of doubt to others on this board in your “evasive” comments that Jim has broken any copyright laws, you are wrong and are blatantly misleading people for “whatever” reason. He is a friend of mine and many others on this board. I have seen the extensive research and study that he does on the beagle breed. He knows different bloodlines and pedigrees inside and out and he takes the time in the woods to see personally the different bloodlines for himself. Jim has written articles in beagle magazines since the late 80’s - early 90’s. And over the years he has had a few in “major” magazines. A few years ago he had one in Outdoor Life and years before that in Fur, Fish & Game.

Now I know you enjoy stirring the pot and causing trouble, some people thrive on drama. Anybody can see that from simply viewing your posts. Kind of like how you insinuated to the whole world that “LR Patch” needed to send home your dog because a year went by and he didn’t pay up, and you did it in between sentences of compliments and ended it with calling him your friend. http://americanbeagler.huntingboards.co ... es#p389848 Real nice, with friends like you, who needs enemies? Just like that should have been kept to a private phone call, why don’t you call up Jim and ask him about your issues with him. Not that anybody cares what you say. Your sarcasm, rudeness and misleading others throughout your posts on this board has long wore out your credibility. By the way, for a guy soooo concerned with other’s originality, I got one question for you… Is “Patch” your real name?

If you read this Bev, sorry but somebody needed to tell him what everybody else is thinking.

[art]

ifc greenwells reggie . thats where bad moon rising gets his hunt from. give reggie a try if you want hunt and nose . he is here in pa with me. thanks . 724-564-5872

[Cannonball08]

You may also check with Smokes Creek Rick Giermata He's in NY, at 716-602-5017 or RJGwoof@aol.com He on the board as Rick G.
If your looking for tons of hunt and ABILITY Laneline and Smokes Creek just about have it covered! If you research the pedigrees they primarly lead back to the Dingus, and other greats.

Second that for one of Ricks Males. Ran with them all, and they are nice and throw nice offspring.

[Bev]

If you read this Bev, sorry but somebody needed to tell him what everybody else is thinking.

I deflect to one of my favorite philosophies. "If one doesn't want his hand bitten, don't stick it in the shark tank."

Could everyone now stop calling and e-mailing Jim Lane with the third degree about whether or not he has broken any copyrite laws? It comes thru his cell phone and that's an annoyance. And it's an annoyance when it starts reaching me. So if you can't stop acting like a bunch of gossipy women, please direct your calls and e-mails instead right to the source who seems to believe that a copyrite law has been marginalized. I'm sure he will have facts to back up that implication.

Thank you. Carry on.

[gwyoung]

deerhost, I have a very long aquantance with Mr. Bill hounds. I know and correspond with people with even more experience. I corresponded with the late "Butch Keene" over the years and our conversations generally centered around Mr. Bill . I have never encountered anyone who said or ever encountered anyone who thought Mr. Bill threw hounds with extra. In my opinion the only time Mr. Bill hounds were barking and another dog wasn't is when the other dog couldn't smell the rabbit. I don't know who told you this ( and I don't doubt your account) But could you ask this person how many Mr. Bill hounds he has witnessed and who owned them, I am very curious about this. Perhaps , he has more experience than the people I know who have bred to Mr. Bill ,numerous times, thanks, in advance.

[Lance]

Dr. Chris, you seem to know the Lane's and their dogs well. I recently visited their website..very nice website if I may add but after looking at what they call their "Core" males and females, I didn't see Laneline anywhere in the pedigrees posted. Can you tell me if they bred any of the dogs that stand behind their "core" hounds? Do you know if the "Dingus" dog has run any trials as of yet. He's a looker for sure! I'm anxious to see how he does as I've heard a lot of talk of him on this board.

[deerhost]

Gwyoung, What I say on here about a dog is what I have been told by someone who I respect and trust or what I have seen with my own eyes. I will not repeat simply things I have read from people I don't know. I owned a male a few years back that went back to Mr. Bill and some of Butch Keene's breeding. I contacted Butch Keene by e-mail and asked him about some of the traits that I saw in my male. I also asked him about the extra mouth my male had and he specifically told me that his ansestors did throw extra mouth at times, and that he did see extra mouth at times in some of the offsprings. The others I have heard from are long time beaglers that have heard it from including one who breeds the line and I met at a few trials and spoke too about Bill breeding and I was told that The line is known for outstanding nose and for being able to straddle the line and run it like it is glued to it, but can sometimes produce offspring with a little extra mouth....Any other questions feel free to PM.........Deerhost

[Dr. Chris]

Dr. Chris, you seem to know the Lane's and their dogs well. I recently visited their website..very nice website if I may add but after looking at what they call their "Core" males and females, I didn't see Laneline anywhere in the pedigrees posted. Can you tell me if they bred any of the dogs that stand behind their "core" hounds? Do you know if the "Dingus" dog has run any trials as of yet. He's a looker for sure! I'm anxious to see how he does as I've heard a lot of talk of him on this board.

Well I can tell you a little bit about some of their dogs. I have been running several times and gun hunting with Jim and a few of those guys. The “core” dogs as you put it are just a few of the dogs that they own. They just put those on their site to give you an example of where their bloodline derived from. As far as dogs with their “kennel name” on their paper work, I know for years if Jim got two dogs that derived from a certain kennel and bred those same two together, he gave their pups that particular kennel name as a tribute to where the dogs derived from. If the dogs that derived from Mr. Larry Perry were bred together their names were Perry’s *******, or if the dogs that derived from John Toy were bred together they were Indian Run ******* or Yellow Creek, but if one from Indian Run was bred to a “Mr. Perry’s hound” They then were given a surname like; Lane’s, Tinkers Creek {which is the road Joe Lane lives on}, Prime Bred, J&J {for Joe & Jim} and Laneline. I think they could care less what names are on the paperwork, just the blood that they carry. As far as I know they have sold all their pups with “blank” paper work, leaving it up to you to name your dog with or without their kennel name. It was just about 10 years ago that Jim and his brother Joe merged their dogs together and started using “Laneline” as a better way to track down their dogs.

Dingus that I know of as of last year has been in 6 trials taken by the Lanes just once, the rest by “trialing friends”, and those were divided up between UKC, ARHA and one AKC. He placed in all of them with four 1st places and he was entered on the bench in two of them and won best male in both and best male and best of show in the other, he is a great looking dog. He is now with a guy in Marion, OH and is getting ready to be campaigned this spring.

But yes, they did breed many of the dogs in their dog’s pedigrees and they got many from Larry Perry, John Toy, Ozzie & Clem from Bev who derived from Kenneth Hill and Dan Kane. And there are a lot of guys out there that have their kennel names on dogs that came from Laneline. But these guys have got a “circle of friends” they work in, what belongs to the Lane’s, also belongs to Larry Perry and it works both ways, and this goes for several breeders within their circle that work together using each other’s stud dogs and brood females together to better each other’s stock. Jim has said more than once that Larry Perry has equal ownership and access to anything he and Joe has and always will, and the same goes for Mike Oszust.

I really don’t know much more to tell you, but they are nice, humble & honest guys, just give them a call. They will tell you that “their dogs are not perfect but they are good enough for them”, and they will do something that many won’t, they will be honest enough to give you a list of their dog’s faults along with their strengths. They are straight up people and will run with anybody at anytime.

But as a little footnote on the sujuct at hand {bloodlines w/tons of hunt}, Jim is really high on Dan Kane's Happyrun stuff and Joe really likes the Green Bay bloodline.

[KesslerBeagles]

I have seen some real good dogs come from Terry McBride and his bloodline. My uncle got 3 from him and loves them, hard, hard hunters! Dr. Chris you are right about them Lanes telling all even on their own hounds. My uncle took one to breed to a male of theirs and he told my uncle after he ran my uncles female that his male had this or that fault and so did my uncles female and you didn't want to combine the two together. He referred my uncle to a different male that would compliment my uncles female. My uncle did breed another female to Lanes male that they thought would compliment each other, both litters turned out great and my uncle and his friends will tell you today that they have the best gun hunting dogs in the country out of those two litters. Mr. Lane could have just took his money and bred his female regardless, but he didn't.

[Lance]

Dingus that I know of as of last year has been in 6 trials taken by the Lanes just once, the rest by “trialing friends”, and those were divided up between UKC, ARHA and one AKC. He placed in all of them with four 1st places and he was entered on the bench in two of them and won best male in both and best male and best of show in the other, he is a great looking dog. He is now with a guy in Marion, OH and is getting ready to be campaigned this spring.

Do you happen to know what format these 1st place wins were in? He has no AKC points and can not find him in 2010 ARHA LP or PP points list. Trying to figure out what style of hound he is. Thanks

[Gunslinger Beagles]

i had a female that was 1/2 northway and 1/2 patch and that dog was the hardest hunting dog i have seen in 20 years of having dogs and being around them all my life. im not trying to promote her i dont own her no more just adding my 2 cents in the mix. she had no regaurd for her body and had honest mouth and run a tight line.

[S.R.Patch]

I don't think AD "rewrote" anything or was a "spell checker" for any body, He went directly to the source to get the story and used individual thought material, "not" copy/past, with a few "In my opinions" to claim ownership . It's the re-writers that have those troubles with the copyright laws is all I'm say'n...
No slam or argument, the truth will bare itself out... ... and I'm sure Jim has some fine hounds.

Sure AD did, along with many other people. Know anything at all about writing? AD took another man’s story, re-wrote it, backed it with facts, writings and quotes from several different earlier previous writings, and mixed in his personal opinions and twists. Nothing wrong with it, that’s the way it is done. As of a matter of fact, in the front of every one of his books he gives a legal right for others to do just that, they can use his material to “re-print” and publish, but not for the sake of profit. He allowed it, because he did it. Along with many others. Rev. John Parks has written some great articles, but he greatly used and quoted AD and others word for word and added his own opinions of the subject and created some great articles that many have tucked away and saved to this day. Nothing wrong with it, that is the way it is done. Not really much is “original”, people can only tell the same story about the same subject in a limited amount of ways without repeating, quoting and sounding a lot like each other.

But if you are attempting to cast a shadow of doubt to others on this board in your “evasive” comments that Jim has broken any copyright laws, you are wrong and are blatantly misleading people for “whatever” reason. He is a friend of mine and many others on this board. I have seen the extensive research and study that he does on the beagle breed. He knows different bloodlines and pedigrees inside and out and he takes the time in the woods to see personally the different bloodlines for himself. Jim has written articles in beagle magazines since the late 80’s - early 90’s. And over the years he has had a few in “major” magazines. A few years ago he had one in Outdoor Life and years before that in Fur, Fish & Game.

Now I know you enjoy stirring the pot and causing trouble, some people thrive on drama. Anybody can see that from simply viewing your posts. Kind of like how you insinuated to the whole world that “LR Patch” needed to send home your dog because a year went by and he didn’t pay up, and you did it in between sentences of compliments and ended it with calling him your friend. http://americanbeagler.huntingboards.co ... es#p389848 Real nice, with friends like you, who needs enemies? Just like that should have been kept to a private phone call, why don’t you call up Jim and ask him about your issues with him. Not that anybody cares what you say. Your sarcasm, rudeness and misleading others throughout your posts on this board has long wore out your credibility. By the way, for a guy soooo concerned with other’s originality, I got one question for you… Is “Patch” your real name?

If you read this Bev, sorry but somebody needed to tell him what everybody else is thinking.

It is of little concern to me, what your "circle of friends" as you depict "everyone", is thinking. I hope you are happy with your hounds and have many enjoyable hunts with your friends. But, you impress me as the type that would invest in the Bank stocks, now that they've made so much money off the backs of the tax payers.just my observation, but like your pokes, that's beside the point.

I've been on here for a few years and I find your comment,... "Your sarcasm, rudeness and misleading others throughout your posts on this board has long wore out your credibility"..., very amusing, and like I've told Bev., the higher some try to elevate themselves, the more of your slip is showing...

From what I've seen, The only fish comfortable or welcome in the "shark tank" are other sharks...many times, a feeding frenzy doth erupt...and after the small fish are eaten, they are calm again amongst their own kind unless, the shark's tender belly is exposed and then, the "topic thread" is locked ...
Kinda reminds me of our Government and the Media...they won't let the people know the truth... but people are not so dumb as they think...

Patch is the family of hounds we breed. I've never tried to take ownership or credit for what others before us have preserved in this line. The same with the English hounds, I was accused of trying to gain some undeserved credit, so I ask Bev to take Postman's picture off the top of the page that she had put on. If she remembers, I told her if these hounds make anything of benefit to our hounds here, it will be by merit of their own quality and not of propaganda suspect to make a dollar, so it is and maybe I've done a poor job, but that's my own bed I've made.
If I've disappointed anyone, it's not been from boasting or bragging on my part, but rather, maybe their perceptions or expectations were to high. One time a fellow ask me, why don't you write a book? I told him then, this is all stuff that's been done and learned before, the path of research and learning is a rewarding road all in of itself, to be spoon fed has not near the satisfaction or reward as "doing it yourself", and I love a treasure hunt.

So you see Dr Chris, where your foot meets the ground is where it stops...welcome to my world...