Gay Marriage

[wireman252]

This is what is wrong with our country today as well as the church! Everything is OK, If it feels good do it! We have set passively by and let out country get in the shape it is in today while trying reason that everything has a place. Some things are just wrong, hense "sin".

Well said brother Collins. I totally agree.

[bucks better beagles]

Reverend Collins: Once again, with all due respect. Who is the arbiter of what is right or wrong. The bible can and is interpreted in many ways as you are very well aware. In a minute, I will ask that we take the bible out of our discussion of this issue and move on to pertinent facts.

JC: How jejune! You would be vainglorious enough to presume my religion. A fellow beagler on here, whom I have grown to admire, said (context) I just give the facts and let the pieces fall where they may. Harry Truman said that he did not give people Hell, he just told the truth and they thought it was Hell. God by the way, had no religion. If you believe in a compassionate God instead of a vengeful God, you will try to do what is right as Reverend Collins says. My issue is just that, what is right? Please no personal attacks on my religion.

If we remove the religious equation (since it is so easy to refute), we are left with several other myths regarding Homosexuality. The New Testament takes no demonstrable position on homosexuality with the exception of Paul's references against same sex eroticism. Course, he also argued against drunkenness but not the drinking of wine.

Some of the myths of which you might want to consider and comment on:

1. People are either homosexual or heterosexual.
2. Homosexuality is contagious.
3. Homosexuality is a choice.
4. Homosexuals recruit others.
5. You can spot a Gay a mile away.
6. There aren't enough gays to really worry about.
7. Homosexuals are promiscuous.
8. Homosexuals are dangerous because they cannot control their sex drives.
9. Homosexuals spread aids.

[wireman252]

Buck,
With respect, I believe you were the first to try and use scripture as a defense for your opinion. I responded first to your opening statement, simply my opinion plus the fact (clearly stated in those verses I and mr.Collins posted) that the subject of "gay marriage" is not a recognized union in the bible, but a sin. Hence my " un-biblical" statement.I ask that you simply read the verses that where posted ,on this subject , for your self. Because as far as I'm concerned it is not only clear to me, but IS fact because it is God's word.
You ask that the bible be left out of this, when in fact, I feel you inaccuratley used God's word to make your opinion sensable to you. I'm not sure what bible you are using but ask you again, with respect and concern for clarity, that you look these verses up in a King James bible. Your opinion on this matter is just that, your opinion. But in "my" opinion it is this mind set that puts another feather in Satan's hat. I pray you see God's word clearly.
With that being said, and forgetting the gay marraige part of your opening statement, this is a great country. I am proud to be an American and am thankful to our veterans , such as yourself, for our freedoms. Thank you for serving Buck.

God bless America,


John Babbitt

[Collins Country]

Buck,
With respect, I believe you were the first to try and use scripture as a defense for your opinion. I responded first to your opening statement, simply my opinion plus the fact (clearly stated in those verses I and mr.Collins posted) that the subject of "gay marriage" is not a recognized union in the bible, but a sin. Hence my " un-biblical" statement.I ask that you simply read the verses that where posted ,on this subject , for your self. Because as far as I'm concerned it is not only clear to me, but IS fact because it is God's word.
You ask that the bible be left out of this, when in fact, I feel you inaccuratley used God's word to make your opinion sensable to you. I'm not sure what bible you are using but ask you again, with respect and concern for clarity, that you look these verses up in a King James bible. Your opinion on this matter is just that, your opinion. But in "my" opinion it is this mind set that puts another feather in Satan's hat. I pray you see God's word clearly.
With that being said, and forgetting the gay marraige part of your opening statement, this is a great country. I am proud to be an American and am thankful to our veterans , such as yourself, for our freedoms. Thank you for serving Buck.

God bless America,


John Babbitt

Words well spoken, Enough Said!

[bucks better beagles]

Thanks John, I am proud to be an American and my service.

I was not the first to use the bible to prove my point here. Please note, the 1st thread after my initial Post, "My opinion.... This " marriage " is unethical, unnatural, immoral and most importantly to me, un - Biblical. It's not a marriage in the eyes of my Lord and savour Jesus Christ. There for I'm against it. Again my opinion........ Oh yeah , God's too."

To me, this constituted a reference to the bible. If I am wrong, I am sorry.

I think you will find that the chapter and verses I quoted are accurate although, I don't claim to be a theologian.

I have read and studied the bible and the responses I have given were thought out as best I could. Jesus was a rebel in his time. IMO: he would not have objected to this action. He walked and talked with prostitutes and thieves and had mercy on all he came in contact with. It was he who spoke of "let you without sin cast the first stone". There are many more unnatural and cruel acts that are spoken of in the Old Testament. It could be read as a real book of pornography if one so desired.

My point is only that 'gay marriage' is neither 'unethical, unnatural, immoral or unbiblical'. It hurts no one. We need not fear it. I would never seek a gay partner (I can't even stomach the thought) but neither would I castigate against someone doing so.

I do not in anyway mean to disrespect your interpretation of the bible. I would defend and have defended people's rights to believe as they will and greatly respect those with close held religious beliefs who try to live a good life based on the principles of Jesus the Christ. I love and respect people who 'witness' for the Lord but I love more those who quietly go about their lives in manner that would be approved by the Lord. The path of righteousness is difficult indeed.

Side bar, You mentioned the King James Version of the Bible. Have you studied the 50 secretaries to King James who were given the task of creating this version is 1620-24? They were quite the crew and James' motive along with the intrigue and politics that went along with the various translations and gospels that were or were not acceptable, is a great historical study. Amazingly, there is very much recorded about this event.

[bucks better beagles]

OOPS; I used the word "pride" in my last post. That is one of the 7 deadly sins. Not trying to be a smartass here but, I try to live without violating those qualities.

[Pine Mt Beagles]

-----MORE PEOPLE HAVE DIED IN THE NAME OF -RELIGION-THAN HAVE DIED BECAUSE OF GREED,AND WHAT RELATIONSHIP.- DOES -RELIGION- HAVE TO BEING A -CHRISTIAN-,OR CHRISTIANITY.

-

If a Republican doesn't like marijuana, he tries to criminalize it.
If a Democrat doesn't like marijuana, he doesn't buy or use it.

If a Republican isn't a homosexual, he tries to criminalize homosexuality.
If a Democrat isn't a homosexual, he doesn't engage in it.

If a Republican doesn't like what's on TV, he complains to the FCC.
If a Democrat doesn't like what's on TV, he changes the channel.

If a Republican thinks getting an abortion is immoral, he tries to criminalize it.
If a Democrat thinks getting an abortion is immoral, she won't get one.

If a Republican believes in God, he demands that everybody believes only in his God.
If a Democrat believes in God, he respects other people's faiths.

If a Republican wants his children to go to a better school, he wants a government voucher system so they can go to a different school.
If a Democrat wants his children to go to a better school, he tries to improve his neighborhood school.

If a Republican likes guns, he ignores the first thirteen words of the Second Amendment and demand the ability to have a loaded concealed automatic weapon in a crowd to see the Prez .
If a Democrat likes guns, he buys a gun and only uses it when necessary.

If a Republican is a victim of a disaster, he demands that the local, state and federal governments help save him.and complains about big government
If a Democrat is a victim of a disaster, he tries to help others worse off.

If a Republican reads this, he’ll delete it because he can't believe any of these things are bad.
If a Democrat reads this, he'll forward it because he knows that Conservatives want everybody to be just like him.
-
-HIPPOCRIT'S-

[bucks better beagles]

Wow PMB:

You sure have a way with words. Political correctness, well, not so much.

[bucks better beagles]

PMB: Do you have an opinion on the gay marriage thing? How about repeal of the 14 th amendment?

[2500 HD]

Gay marraige is wrong .....Bottom line...... wrong.........my opinion

[jcbeagler]

Common sence will tell you that. I will amen that.

Gay marraige is wrong .....Bottom line...... wrong.........my opinion

[Collins Country]

-----MORE PEOPLE HAVE DIED IN THE NAME OF -RELIGION-THAN HAVE DIED BECAUSE OF GREED,AND WHAT RELATIONSHIP.- DOES -RELIGION- HAVE TO BEING A -CHRISTIAN-,OR CHRISTIANITY.

-

If a Republican doesn't like marijuana, he tries to criminalize it.
If a Democrat doesn't like marijuana, he doesn't buy or use it.

If a Republican isn't a homosexual, he tries to criminalize homosexuality.
If a Democrat isn't a homosexual, he doesn't engage in it.

If a Republican doesn't like what's on TV, he complains to the FCC.
If a Democrat doesn't like what's on TV, he changes the channel.

If a Republican thinks getting an abortion is immoral, he tries to criminalize it.
If a Democrat thinks getting an abortion is immoral, she won't get one.

If a Republican believes in God, he demands that everybody believes only in his God.
If a Democrat believes in God, he respects other people's faiths.

If a Republican wants his children to go to a better school, he wants a government voucher system so they can go to a different school.
If a Democrat wants his children to go to a better school, he tries to improve his neighborhood school.

If a Republican likes guns, he ignores the first thirteen words of the Second Amendment and demand the ability to have a loaded concealed automatic weapon in a crowd to see the Prez .
If a Democrat likes guns, he buys a gun and only uses it when necessary.

If a Republican is a victim of a disaster, he demands that the local, state and federal governments help save him.and complains about big government
If a Democrat is a victim of a disaster, he tries to help others worse off.

If a Republican reads this, he’ll delete it because he can't believe any of these things are bad.
If a Democrat reads this, he'll forward it because he knows that Conservatives want everybody to be just like him.
-
-HIPPOCRIT'S-

Wow! Not seen ya on here for a few days and your still just as misguided as ever!

Did a republican steel your candy?

[bucks better beagles]

Collins Country wrote: Did a republican steel your candy?

People tell me I don't have much of a sense of humor, but that was funny considering the context.

[hogbody]

I always find it interesting when people make Old Testament references to all the bad people and the bad things those people did as justification for continued unrepentant sin. Since the Garden of Eden man has been under the curse of sin. That still doesn’t make it right in God’s eyes. Yes we are all sinners. Rom 3:10, “There is no one righteous, not even one” we are all condemned, but thank God there is a way out of this mess. Rom 7:24, “What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God – through Jesus Christ our Lord”.

The other thing I find interesting is the notion that since Jesus hung out with prostitutes, tax collectors and sinners, that he was OK with what they were doing. He hung out with them because they needed to be saved from their sins. Matt 9:12, “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick.” Jesus does love the sinner but hates the sin, which is why he calls us to repentance. Mark 1:4, “And so John came, baptizing in the desert region and preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins”. And Mark 1:14-15, “ And after John was put in prison, Jesus went into Galilee, proclaiming the good news of God. “The time has come” He said, “The kingdom of God is near. Repent and believe the good news””. What did Jesus say to the adulterous woman who was to be stoned before he stepped in? “Go now and leave your life of sin”

We are all born with sin and have a sin nature but we are called to recognize sin and turn our backs on it and turn to God. Is homosexuality a sin? I think so, the Bible clearly says it is. You say Jesus never mentioned homosexuality? Well he never mentioned abortion either. Is pulling a developed baby partially from the womb and sticking a needle in it’s brain a sin? I think so, don’t you? You say the homosexual is born that way. May be, may be not. But I think it is still a sin tendency that should be avoided. Just because you feel gay doesn’t mean you have to act on that tendency. Let me give you an example from my own life. I used to like to drink a lot of beer, and I mean a lot, every day. When I came to the Lord and recognized my sin I stopped. Now, do I still want to drink a lot of beer? You bet I do. If I had my way I would have a fridge full and I would be cracking one as soon as I got home every night. But I don’t because I want to honor God with my body and my life, Rom 12:1, “Therefore, I urge you, brothers, in view of God’s mercy, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices, holy and pleasing to God.” Also like any man I enjoy looking at a naked woman ( C’mon I’m only human). Do I want to look at a Playboy magazine, you bet I do but I don’t, because I know it is sinful and that is not God’s will for my life. You see, just because we feel like doing something doesn’t make it right. “What a wicked man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God - through Jesus Christ our Lord.” I’m not perfect but I try to stay focused on Jesus and pray He leads me from my sin tendency and into his will.

I left a church because of the ordination of gay clergy. Why, because I don’t like gays, no because it is just not right in my eyes and definitely not right in God’s eyes. I thought it was ironic at the time because I was on the church board. The same nights we had our board meetings a group from Alcoholics Ammoniums meet in the same building in a room just above us. Now these men were consumed by the sin of drunkenness at some point in their lives. Yet they meet to acknowledge their sin and their problem and to encourage one another not to fall back into their former destructive life style. Then here we were just below them discussing gay ministers, go figure.

I know, there are a lot of descent gay people. I don’t have a problem with them having some sort of legal contract for property and estate reasons. But please don’t tell me that they should be able to have a recognized marriage just as a man and women. Don’t tell little children in school that all this is OK.

Like the old saying goes “You gotta stand for something, or you’re gonna fall for anything”

God Bless You All!

[bucks better beagles]

Hogbody: Would it be alright with you if it was called a "gay union" instead of "gay marriage"? I ask this because you said..." I don’t have a problem with them having some sort of legal contract for property and estate reasons". I wrestle with this idea. Seems that if gay people could have all the legal ramifications of a marriage, what difference does it matter what it is called. Leave the "marriage" label for heterosexuals and simply call gay unions something else. If it is consensual, why does it matter to the rest of us.

Personally, I don't care what my relationship with my wife was called but the commitment was an important symbol.