COLDTRAILIN

[ACOMEAU]

Beaglebill, If your buddy doesn't want the dog, send it my way.

[Hunt6]

I'm kinda like Wartdog.I like a dog with a big nose capable of working a cold track out to completion.Not the babblers that suck scent and bark in one spot all night.

The trouble with hounds today is they are like Doctors.Very,very specialized.Specialist within specialized departments.Kinda like going to a proctologist when you have an ear ache.No way he can fix things from his end.

Now trial type people would not like a dog that cold trails.Me I've always called it "drifting" a bad track.The hound or beagle is getting some scent and making forward progress with a tap here and a tap there to let me know where he is headed.They work it up to where they can pressure it - run it to a tree or get it bayed up and or bring around to the gun.I like that kind of dog.I've watched lion dogs do that as well as coon dogs in the moon light work their magic. Same with some beagles I've owned or that friends had that worked those cold tracks to completion.

Everywhere this southern boy has lived you can use such a dog.Game can be scarce year to year snow is snow whereever it falls. I'll say this gentlemen it is a thing of beauty to watch such dog work.

I call them complete hounds and yes they are rare and under appreciated.IMO.I'm not so sure that a hit off a good - small 45 lb lion dog - rig dog or two would not go a long way toward fixing a few things in most beagle blood lines. Nose and hunt come to mind. Hunt6 (David P,)

[g. isom]

I'm new to this board and don't reply much,but on the subject of coldtrailin i've read and noticed some of you guys talks like if you don't have a cold-nosed dog in certain areas of the country that you probably won't jump no rabbits. If you have dogs that will get in the brush and hunt you should have no problems jumping rabbits no matter how cold it is. Personnely I wouldn't have a dog that barked before the rabbit is jumped no matter how many rabbits it could eventually jump. It's no fun standing in zero temperatures waiting on a cold-trailing dog thats been barking for 20 minutes to jump a rabbit. Just my opinion

[Steve C.]

Remember, a hot nosed dog may work the same track identically to the cold nosed dog. The difference is he will not open til the game is jumped. The reason this is generally preferred is because he is not interrupting the work of other hounds in the pack working independently. One will not produce any more rabbits than the other. It's a common belief that the cold trailer has the better nose. Maybe, but not necessarily. The smart dog knows if the track is runnable and may give a bit of tongue before the game is jumped- perfectly acceptable; as long as the game DOES get jumped before long. With coon and cat dogs, I always preferred a track drifter, but a beagle who drifts a track is going to lose a lot of tracks. As someone mentioned earlier, a good snow hound runs a track by sight, but uses his nose to validate the line. Most good snow hounds don't switch hare either- they can differentiate one track from that of another, and will remember where that track is once the game is shot. In northern Maine we have only hare. The question I have for you cottontail hunters is concerning the habit they have of holing up in bad weather. Will a cold nosed hound trail a lot of tracks to a hole? This would be my concern with a cold trailer.

[cooper]

Well said Laal!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Chris]

The trouble with hounds today is they are like Doctors.Very,very specialized.

That's true, for the most part, and we can mostly thank the various field trial formats that might reward the specialist dog (does one thing exceptionally well) over a well-rounded gundog. The sad truth is that more people field trial than gun hunt. And, there's no way for a 1 or 2 day field trial to adequately test all the traits that make up a quality gundog.

If you have dogs that will get in the brush and hunt you should have no problems jumping rabbits no matter how cold it is.

Jumping the rabbit's isn't the problem. It's running the track once they're jumped. Most dogs that can run tracks in terrible conditions are dogs that pop off here and there while working a colder track. These dogs get the track going virtually all the time, but they're usually the first ones to bark and you can trust them.

Remember, a hot nosed dog may work the same track identically to the cold nosed dog. The difference is he will not open til the game is jumped. The reason this is generally preferred is because he is not interrupting the work of other hounds in the pack working independently. One will not produce any more rabbits than the other.

In theory, maybe Steve. But, in practice it's the dog that does a bit of cold trailing that has the nose to run when it gets really tough. Coincidence? Probably not.

Most really tough days it's this type dog that produces the one or two rabbits that you'll shoot and the hot-nosed trial-type dog won't smell enough to bark unless it's where the rabbit has sat for a bit, or some other place where the rabbit has happened to leave more scent.

The smart dog knows if the track is runnable and may give a bit of tongue before the game is jumped- perfectly acceptable; as long as the game DOES get jumped before long.

Couldn't agree more.

[Robert W. Mccoy Jr]

I like a dog to cold track silent not saying a word untill they get right up on the rabbit.

I like this for two reasons.
1. If nothing turns out form there efforts the rest of the pack isn't disturbed and they continue to hunt there own rabbit.

2. If the dog is left alone to sort the track out with out other dogs messing the scent up he can normally do a better job at jumping the rabbit.

I find these dogs are far and few between but thats the kind of cold trainling I like to see.

[Big Dog]

Chris I have to disagree with you on the comment about their are more field trialers than hunters. I think gun hunters outnumber field trialers by far. I know at least 4 guys that gun hunt to every 1 that trials. In the south almost everyone has a couple of beagles in the back yard and most of them have never even thought of attending a trial.

Big Dog

[Robert W. Mccoy Jr]

I agree

I seldom trial my dogs.
Maybe twice a year.

I hunt my dog's from december to match and run them rest of the year.

Trialing just has never really interreasted me that much.

[Btrull]

yea, many more gun hunters than field trialers. I dont necessarily agree with the hound that sounds before the game is up always has a better nose. I want the hound that produces game. A hound with a powerful nose that is an idiot or has other faults wont produce many bunnies. Results are what counts. The best dog that I ever owned was tight mouth and cheated some but didnt disrupt the pack and always produced rabbits to the gun or caught them. Yet some other hounds I had would be poppin off while Bessie was running to catch and eat !!! Good running

Brad

[wvrabbithunter]

i just read these post for about the ten times,i just wander if some of these people have ever shot a rabbit
we got 6 inches of snow last night,the rabbits are seting tight,but they are runable with a good dog or a pack of dogs,i like to take two or three dogs at a time,that way i know who is doing ,but on days like this they need to work togather,a dog knows who is a boo hooer
and and a dog that is working a track their are dogs that open like they are running a rabbit but are really on a cold track and their are dog that bark on a cold track,i dont like a dog that runs ghost rabbits,but on bad days i like a dog that will bark alittle on cold tracks that lets the pack know that this dog has rabbit sent and brings the pack over to help get it up,just my input,thanks frank

[Joe West]

I don't expect the hounds to open until they have their rabbit up and moveing. No reason for them to open on a cold line; they can work it up without opening.

[Steve C.]

Most of the good hounds I've owned who had the nose to run in any condition NEVER tongued til the game was jumped. A few did but that never bothered me much. Lots of guys confuse lots of mouth with a big nose but the two are not necessarily linked. Took two hounds out yesterday before the snowstorm hit. It was about 10 degrees, fairly windy and heavy frost on the ground. The dogs were cast and they immediately began working a line. You could tell they struggled to get scent but the tails were going and they obviously had scent. After about 10 minutes and about 75 yards, they jumped the hare and the chase was on. Neither opened before the jump even though the older dog will occasionally tongue an old line a bit on really tough days and the young dog has extra mouth at times. Both these hounds have as good a nose as anyone could want in a dog, which is why I ran them on this day. Despite a lot of hard checks and tough running they never lost the hare. I saw him three times but either he got by me or was too close for a shot. After an hour and ten minutes I took him in the trail and picked the hounds up as the storm was beginning to intensify. Not a perfect day, but these two bitches did a good job on a tough day. A bit of extra mouth on a cold track or in the check area doesn't bother me much but it doesn't go hand in hand with great nose. The perfect dog would never open on a cold track and I've been fortunate to have a few that were not only exceptional jump dogs, but NEVER tongued til the game was jumped. Two of these hounds were also International Field Champions and another could have finished had I trialed her more. Specialists? Maybe, but not only did these hounds impress field trial judges, they also accounted for hundreds of hare during our winter hunts. I'll agree there are plenty of champions out there that I wouldn't want to hunt with, but if the hound truly has the talent to account for game under all conditions, there are enough good houndsmen out there judging trials that will notice them. The true test of a hound is in the woods under the gun but I'll continue to participate in trials if for no other reason than to find other hounds I admire.

[power]

I breed for nose and line control + hunt. wiht most dogs i raise i see the more you run them the better they get about not cold-trailing. A guy told me once that there was not a dog in my pen that wouldnt cold trial. i dint believe him because at the time none did. but after laying a coulpe up for various reasons both decide to start it. alos they backtracked , which they had never done before. but aafter a few good runs all that went away. so dont be too hard a hound right off. give him a chance to prove themselves.

[louis]

My grandfather had a bitch that would run a three day old track just like most would one three minutes old he kept her for breeding as her pups all had excellent noses and only one out of four litters would cold trail like her(that we knew of) The only time we took her hunting was when it was 10 below zero or colder because she would then run a good track because of the lack of scent on those days (I guess) the other dogs couldnt keep up with her on those freezing cold days.
I also had a redbone female I hunted on rabbits that when she couldnt find a hot track after a while she would open up on a cold one and run it fast and hard screaming for all she was worth through the area. I thought she had lost her mind the first time she did this but then she stopped came back to me and started hunting again and had moved the rabbits around some so she could find a track and run. I dont know how she figured this out but it worked for her and me.