NEW TREND

[TomMN]

This trend has been going on in coonhounds for years. The latest thing is breeding dogs with an "All Grand" pedigree, first 3 generations, then 4, now I think they are up to 6 generations. Pups from these dogs go for unbelievable prices, often $1000 a pup. I can't help but wonder how many thousand dollar pups are buried behind some of these guys kennels. The funny thing is, none of these "All Grand" dogs has ever won a major hunt. They do most of their winning at the local clubs when 8 or 10 dogs show up for the hunt.

I've been breeding hounds for years and used to haul females all over the country to breed to these big name stud dogs. My best pups have always come from my own dogs or ones that I know well.

[Big Dog]

A lot of people that trial heavy in AkC do not profess to be big breeders, they would much rather buy a pup at 3 or 4 months old get it started and work with it to see if it has the proper tools. I personally hate young puppies. If it were up to me they would all be born already 6 months old and I could start them the next day.(LOL) They are cute, but I hate staying up with a bitch all night while she is whelping, moving the bitch into my garage to have pups because it's too cold outside, listening to my wife b--tch because the stinking dog is in the garage barking at her when she parks her truck, all of the worming, constant yapping, playing grab ass, running them down, teaching them to handle and other things that you have to do before you ever know if they are gonna make a dog or not.

Big Dog

[ANTHONY KERR]

What amazes me the most is beaglers who finish dog for AKC champion, but cannot breed one themselves.

Why not learn or benefit from someone elses success or homework.
I looked for a common denominator in two dogs pedigrees last night and came up blank. My female is in heat she is fast and needs tough condition nose and is maybe a little tight mouthed in a pack. My male is medium fast with a good nose and plenty of mouth. He could use a little more hunt that the female has. A blend of the two would be nice but it would be a total outcross. They are both good dogs should I make the cross ? I don't know, but the clock is ticking.

[S.R.Patch]

"Red Letter" breeding,... This "NEW TREND" is as old and as common, to a greater or lesser degree over the years, for as long as field trials and dog shows have been in existence.
The idea of breeding the best(winners) to the best(winners) and using the field trials or dog shows as a measuring stick only shows how incomplete each format is at selecting the best overall hound, and, the fact that performers and producers are rarely one and the same.
A hound is the sum of it's parents, what it is and what it may pass on are not a mirror of it'self, but a vast mix of it's ancestors, the greater the mix of different hounds involved in the pedigree, the greater the possibilities of variables differing from what you hoped to get in your pups.
Randall always said, "get fewer individuals in the pedigrees of your pups, and provided they are the right kind, so much better will be the offspring"...
I just got two pups because they had my old Buckeye, Shildts Gypsy and Gunsmoke up in the pedigree. The rest of the hounds are also related to these in the pedigree, and all descend from the same hounds. There is no "red letter" window dressing around their names, only hounds that made the cut and were proved to be rabbit hounds and produce the same...This way, if crosses don't work, they are allowed to fade out of the pedigree and the good ones brought to the front. If one had the "red letter" dressing around his name, it might infulence some to keep him strong in the mix, tho he may contribute nothing or even produced a fault that was good for a field trial, but bad for a hunting hound.
This also brings to mind something Randall said, "if your in want of a field trial hound, buy from those who are successful in the trials, if your in need of a rabbit hound, buy from those who HUNT!...
Good luck to all, in getting what your after...

[Mapel Valley Kennels LLC.]

Whats her breeding? Males that dont hunt seem to throw it. JMHO

[Mapel Valley Kennels LLC.]

You bring up, a great comment patch. I have heard it for years."If you want a gun dog ask a hunter" If you want a trial dog ask a trialer. Not
for the wants of a argument, which i dont. If i own a dog it will hunt and as well as compete, The second point i would like to bring up is this.
If people would get off the internet and go watch some of the great stud hounds run, instead of watching the couch and talking on there phone we would better the breed. I was told years ago thats why we have 2 ears and 1 mouth to listen more than we talk. As far as the dog tied behind the barn comment.More than likely he is Branko bred anyway. We and i think i speak for most of my friends, gun hunt our dogs if they have titles or not.
Dogs are bred to run not to look at there accomplishments we gather, while we tell everyone else how great they are on our cell phones and sit our butts on the recliner in the comfort of heat. So after all these years
The buy from this and by from that comment still makes absolutly no sense to me what so ever.

[ANTHONY KERR]

Whats her breeding? Males that dont hunt seem to throw it. JMHO

Jimmy if the question is for me, my female is a Chester daughter with a T-Rex bottom. Lots of grit she just could use more nose. Hates a rabbit. While the male is not a brush buster he starts alot of races and gets dirty once a rabbit has been smelled. He has a Branko x Heavy Ace in the Hole back ground. The Branko side is Alibaba, if you look way back you see Dingus alot for whatever that is worth. By looking for common ancestors you don't see alot in a few generations. I like both hounds and trial and hunt them both. They both just turned three and have prepaid their rent for a few years to come. Like anything else it would probably be a crap shoot. What do you think ?
Anthony

[jlboomer]

been rabbit hunting for 18 yrs and have never breed to any of these champion dogs and most likely never will as i keep worthy enough males from my hunting stock to breed some of you have hunted with me and know my dogs heck rufus you even hunted with me years back when i was a boy lol dogs may have not minded the best but they would pure it on a rabbit. Im not trying to be biest but trials have left a bad taste in my mouth beagle and coonhound so i don't want any part of them anymore i do agree that there a many fine hound sitting in someones back yard being used as a meat dog that would probably throw some awsume pups take the time guys to give these dogs a glance you sure will save alot of money and time if your smart.

[danny vansickle]

I HAVE BEEN IN BEAGLING ABOUT 34 YEARS IN THE LAST COUPLE YEARS I HAVE WATCHED AS A NEW TREND HAS STARTED, SEEMS THE MAJORITY OF BEAGLERS.NOT TRUE" HOUNDS MEN" ARE GOING TO THE MOST POPULAR DOGS WITH NO INTEREST IN A GOOD DOG .I GUESS IF IT'S NOT POPULAR OR WELL KNOWN IT'S NOT, NOTE WORTHY .BUT THERE ARE SEVERAL DOG'S WINNING AND PLACING ALL OVER AND ARE STILL NOT BEING USED FOR" BREEDING" BE IT MALE OR FEMALE.I CANNOT UNDERSTAND HOW DOES A DOG GET TO BE WELL KNOWN IT CAN'T BE HOW MUCH HE WIN'S OR WHO OWNS IT .AT FIRST THAT WAS MY THINKING BUT AS OF LATE THAT HAS BEEN PROVEN WRONG ...ANY THOUGHT'S ON THE THIS ------------NOT IMPORTANT JUST-- CURIOUS --
P.S. KEVIN GLAD TO HEAR REGGIE IS GOING TO BE OK.
KEEP'EM RUNNING
PINE MT BEAGLES

so,are you insinuating that the people breeding to reggie are not "houndsmen"?
and that he is not worthy of the hype and the popularity?

the dog has done more in 13 short months than most people will accomplish with their entire line of hounds,i aint tryin to stir trouble,but the lil p.s. is obviously a shot at reggie,believe me rufus,he earned everything he has gotten and fact is he is a reproducer worthy of the hype,he has pups placing and winning in every format out there.

[Pine Mt Beagles]

THE P.S. ABOUT REGGIE IS JUST WHAT IT SAID.I'M GLAD HE IS OK .SINCERILY..GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT.I HAVE NEVER SAW -REGGIE-DON'T THINK I HAVE MET KEVIN HEARD A LOT ABOUT BOTH OF THEM .DON'T PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH I CAN SPEAK FOR MY SELF .AND LOVE TO .----------------NOW BACK TO THE SUBJECT I SAY A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE BREEDING BECAUSE OF WHAT SOME ONE TOLD THEM.I BRED A DOG NAMED BLUE BANKS SWEET SINGER NO TITLES AT ALL TO A DOG NAMED DANDY RUN NORTH STAR NO ONE HAD HARDLY HEARD OF EITHER PINE MT CHESTER IS A PRODUCT OF THIS CROSS YOU WILL FIND HIM IN THE PEDS OF A LOT OF DOGS HUNTING AND WINNING IN TRIALS TODAY I ALSO CROSSED STAR WITH KINGWOODS T REX NO TITLES AT ALL HE IS BEHIND A LOT OF DOGS HUNTING AND PLACING TODAY. IF I HAD BEEN A TITLE HUNTER THESE BREEDINGS WOULD NEVER HAVE HAPPENED AND I WAS TRIALING HEAVY AT THE TIME.---IF YOU BREED A VERY GOOD DOG TO A VERY GOOD DOG -YOU MIGHT GET HALF THE LITTER TO BE GOOD ----.BUT IF YOU BREED 100 DOGS TO THE SAME MALE OR FEMALE AND THEY HAVE 6 PUPS IN EACH LITTER .IF YOUR LUCK-- HOLDS-- SOUNDS LIKE ABOUT 300 CULLS TO ME BUT I'M NOT VERY GOOD AT MATH..I PERSONALLY THINK EVERY ONE SHOULD BREED WHAT THEY ARE CONFIDENT WITH ..THE GUY'S I RUN WITH AND MY SELF HAVE BEEN USING THE SAME STUFF FOR ABOUT 12 YEARS AND IT'S STILL PRODUCING AND SHOULD FOR 10 OR 12 MORE .YEARS
I WOULD JUST LIKE TO SEE PAOPLE PUT A LITTLE MORE THOUGHT INTO THEIR BREEDINGS.SO WE WILL HAVE BETTER HOUNDS DOWN THE ROAD .
THAT'S ALL I'M TRYING TO SAY..
I BREED TO MY OWN HOUNDS DON'T GO OUT MUCH .I GUESS I'M JUST KENNEL BLIND-------------GOOD LUCK TO EVERY ONE---YOU TOM WILL MASON--

KEEP'EM RUNNING
PINE MT BEAGLES

[Mapel Valley Kennels LLC.]

Whats her breeding? Males that dont hunt seem to throw it. JMHO

Jimmy if the question is for me, my female is a Chester daughter with a T-Rex bottom. Lots of grit she just could use more nose. Hates a rabbit. While the male is not a brush buster he starts alot of races and gets dirty once a rabbit has been smelled. He has a Branko x Heavy Ace in the Hole back ground. The Branko side is Alibaba, if you look way back you see Dingus alot for whatever that is worth. By looking for common ancestors you don't see alot in a few generations. I like both hounds and trial and hunt them both. They both just turned three and have prepaid their rent for a few years to come. Like anything else it would probably be a crap shoot. What do you think ?
Anthony

For what its worth anthony, the problem with t-rex is he throws x-treme hunt and awesome mouth. Just tight with it.I have yet to see a loose mouth t-rex dog.They all pocess the same trait which is hunt and bottom end.If it was me and i didnt mind the drive and you like the bitch, contact will mason and bred to John Henry. I will actually help you out i got the stud fee to him for 50 dollars if will is ok with it use it and pay me.He is one of the best studs out there that aint got the light shined on him as of yet. You are doubling chester and throwng strong spur close.Its a no brainer look at him on the stud fee auction.I have hunted with him and he has a great mouth. I am leary of t-rex too many times up close. But t-rex dogs also will loosen that mouth up at about 4 years old then pour it.I have never understood why ,just learned too live with it as they generally out jump most dogs 3 to 1 anyway.Obviously there is no more chester and or t-rex .Us dum hillbillys got the market corned in ky. But tarheels aint to bad like to see some flow your way.Let me know if i can help

[Mapel Valley Kennels LLC.]

I HAVE BEEN IN BEAGLING ABOUT 34 YEARS IN THE LAST COUPLE YEARS I HAVE WATCHED AS A NEW TREND HAS STARTED, SEEMS THE MAJORITY OF BEAGLERS.NOT TRUE" HOUNDS MEN" ARE GOING TO THE MOST POPULAR DOGS WITH NO INTEREST IN A GOOD DOG .I GUESS IF IT'S NOT POPULAR OR WELL KNOWN IT'S NOT, NOTE WORTHY .BUT THERE ARE SEVERAL DOG'S WINNING AND PLACING ALL OVER AND ARE STILL NOT BEING USED FOR" BREEDING" BE IT MALE OR FEMALE.I CANNOT UNDERSTAND HOW DOES A DOG GET TO BE WELL KNOWN IT CAN'T BE HOW MUCH HE WIN'S OR WHO OWNS IT .AT FIRST THAT WAS MY THINKING BUT AS OF LATE THAT HAS BEEN PROVEN WRONG ...ANY THOUGHT'S ON THE THIS ------------NOT IMPORTANT JUST-- CURIOUS --
P.S. KEVIN GLAD TO HEAR REGGIE IS GOING TO BE OK.
KEEP'EM RUNNING
PINE MT BEAGLES

so,are you insinuating that the people breeding to reggie are not "houndsmen"?
and that he is not worthy of the hype and the popularity?

the dog has done more in 13 short months than most people will accomplish with their entire line of hounds,i aint tryin to stir trouble,but the lil p.s. is obviously a shot at reggie,believe me rufus,he earned everything he has gotten and fact is he is a reproducer worthy of the hype,he has pups placing and winning in every format out there.

Danny ol rufe aint messing with kevin just asking questions.You are right reggie has accomplished more in 13 months than any dog i have known.
I think i remeber you stating that he has bred 78 bitches earlier in a post ?
At a average of lets say 6 pups per litter thats comes to 468 dogs. I am willing to bet out of 468 dogs 100 go to hunters and the other 368 go to trialers. So at 15600.00 dollars worth of stud fees as well as reputation
I would hope to see at least 200 of the 368 have some type of titles.Thats
asking alot of any stud dog at 60% percent achievment is awesome, i hope reggie lives up to his name cause his breeder as well as his buddie
screwed me out of 100.00 dollars cause few people know I bred Junie to reggies mom.I got screwed out of stud fee as well as pup. So as far as greenwell and bobby go .I hope they rot.See i am paul harvey and thats the rest of the story.

[wvduece]

jimmy do you have juneee for public stud im not a trialer just a hunter n more of a pleasure runner but i do run good blooded dogs if he is for public stud how can someone get hold of you to discuss the breeding thanks jb ps me n a buddy was discussing this the other nite n i metioned your dog junee but didnt have no info how to get in touch with ya, he dont trial either but has akc dogs like myself he sent his female up in northern wv to breed to a no name YET dog to be bred we both have watched this dog run he is a powerhouse i belive he will be making some noise real shortly we have between us 2 guys we have 10 females n we will be doing some more breeding down the road jb

[danny vansickle]

I HAVE BEEN IN BEAGLING ABOUT 34 YEARS IN THE LAST COUPLE YEARS I HAVE WATCHED AS A NEW TREND HAS STARTED, SEEMS THE MAJORITY OF BEAGLERS.NOT TRUE" HOUNDS MEN" ARE GOING TO THE MOST POPULAR DOGS WITH NO INTEREST IN A GOOD DOG .I GUESS IF IT'S NOT POPULAR OR WELL KNOWN IT'S NOT, NOTE WORTHY .BUT THERE ARE SEVERAL DOG'S WINNING AND PLACING ALL OVER AND ARE STILL NOT BEING USED FOR" BREEDING" BE IT MALE OR FEMALE.I CANNOT UNDERSTAND HOW DOES A DOG GET TO BE WELL KNOWN IT CAN'T BE HOW MUCH HE WIN'S OR WHO OWNS IT .AT FIRST THAT WAS MY THINKING BUT AS OF LATE THAT HAS BEEN PROVEN WRONG ...ANY THOUGHT'S ON THE THIS ------------NOT IMPORTANT JUST-- CURIOUS --
P.S. KEVIN GLAD TO HEAR REGGIE IS GOING TO BE OK.
KEEP'EM RUNNING
PINE MT BEAGLES

so,are you insinuating that the people breeding to reggie are not "houndsmen"?
and that he is not worthy of the hype and the popularity?

the dog has done more in 13 short months than most people will accomplish with their entire line of hounds,i aint tryin to stir trouble,but the lil p.s. is obviously a shot at reggie,believe me rufus,he earned everything he has gotten and fact is he is a reproducer worthy of the hype,he has pups placing and winning in every format out there.

Danny ol rufe aint messing with kevin just asking questions.You are right reggie has accomplished more in 13 months than any dog i have known.
I think i remeber you stating that he has bred 78 bitches earlier in a post ?
At a average of lets say 6 pups per litter thats comes to 468 dogs. I am willing to bet out of 468 dogs 100 go to hunters and the other 368 go to trialers. So at 15600.00 dollars worth of stud fees as well as reputation
I would hope to see at least 200 of the 368 have some type of titles.Thats
asking alot of any stud dog at 60% percent achievment is awesome, i hope reggie lives up to his name cause his breeder as well as his buddie
screwed me out of 100.00 dollars cause few people know I bred Junie to reggies mom.I got screwed out of stud fee as well as pup. So as far as greenwell and bobby go .I hope they rot.See i am paul harvey and thats the rest of the story.

dang jimmie,you lost me in all that percintages and plus and minuses,and blair said he was the brains of the opperation

i know i defend reggie a lot,but i am here right down the road and i see all the people comin and breedin to him,they are not half a$$ beaglers,they are top notch houndsmen and they travel far to do it,but the other side i see what reggie is throwin livin here where every local guy has a reggie pup in his box,just like you see what junie is throwin cause everyone down your way breeds to him,i have a feeling that when it is all said and done,and all these pups are three years old,everyone will see,we are witnessing the rise of a generation of great reproducers such as reggie,junie,trailblazer,thunder,blueman ect. ect.

[Mapel Valley Kennels LLC.]

Danny i aint in anyway discrediting reggie. He is the dog i just got to mixing up numbers. I hope someday i get to look back and say "I saw reggie run" Kevin is a smart bussiness man. His invesment has payed itself off several times over. I actually kinda envy him he has done it all
in every format. Reggie has produced as may dogs as i have seen in the modern era. He has big shoes to fill as his ancestors before him. I think he is the dog for the calling , I just want to set back and see where they all are in 4 years, i wish the best for kevin as we been friends for sometime. I just wonder sometimes what if Don Hogg would just say
Junie has the charestics of turbo.And is the best looking turbo dog he has seen. Just kidding danny, see ya at jackson.I still need directions from
Mt.Sterling Ky.See ya sat .Ps.Please refrain from taking off ur shirt.
Want Fries with that?
Jimbo.