Speed verses Medium speed with line control

[CHAD_PLUNKETT]

Incahoots how is it the handlers fault if the dog wont stay close on a check?

[mike crabtree]

I agree a handler has nothing to do with where a dog goes in the check.

[bun-e-chaser]

A dog's check ability is in the breeding, the handler has nothing to do with it. I have been handling my own dogs for 25 yrs and have had dogs that were tight and ones that were loose on checks. I can show you the difference in the dogs by their pedigrees. I have had patch hounds that had line control and I have had SPO dogs that had none. But when it comes down to keeping a cottontail circling, give me a well bred med speed gundog with good line control and tight check work anyday. I just bought an 8 mo. old redtick female that is one of the smoothest dogs on line that I have seen in 15 yrs. She keeps it between her legs and keeps moving forward the entire time, she is almost too tight on checks, working right off the point of loss and gradually working out. She is med. speed and hopefully will get better with age and experience. I will solo her alot.

[Incahoots]

How you run a dog can make it or break it. I solo 5-6 days a week 1 1/2 - 3 hours each dog and pack 1 day. Solo time strenghens and locks traits that no amount of pack time can accomplish and does it faster. Can I make a dog stick a check? No not phsyically. However, more likely then not the way I run them they will stick a check and all their traits become stronger opposed to a dog that recieves very little solo time. Theres a fine line between being competitive and crazy. The handler can bring out the best or worst in a dog.

[klrconcrete]

Sounds like incahoots is the man to listen to I agree with some of what he says but disagree with about as much Solo time is in my opinion the best medicine for a young dog but as that dog matures a brace or a small pack can be as or more beneficial in my opinion, I also think that the style of a dog is just that-- its style a person may be able to sculpt some of the behavior but I think thats about it.

[gus]

I suppose since handlers are so important in the development of a beagle there is no need to worry about pedigrees?

When I witness hare bred dogs dominating the deep south SPO then I will put more credence to the handling theory. Until then I will be depending more on pedigrees.

[blackdirt beagles]

you cant make an orange taste like an apple . a handler can only bring out of a dog what is in the dogs genetic makeup. you can try to curb bad habits or make them stay closer on checks with soloing but its the dog, not the handler who has final say. i got a young male right now doing a great job but he wont pack up to save his life. he'll run a bit with just 1 dog but when there is more than that he is going to split off and go his own way. otherwise hes the perfect (my opinion ) 15 month old dog. hes plenty confident and will fire out of a check or jump right in on a strike, plenty of speed, plenty of nose, just dont like company... and all the soloing or packing i can give him isnt helping out, because its the dog not the handler. hopefully over the summer he'll mature into a more of a pack dog, otherwise someone else will be feeding a pretty tough "solo" dog.

[warddog]

He must be non-union as he wants to do it solo instead of fitting in with a pack of others. Maybe if you furnished him a new pickup truck to ride in or a shiny new dog box. Hey, I got it buy him a new designer Niki collar that lights up or something and he may come your way and work together a little better. Thought you liked that non-union stuff but now you're wanting to kick him to the curb for wanting to do it solo in stead of with a pack. LOL Couldn't resist that one and Chris can't kick me to the curb here either as you know HE don't like that crap.

[blackdirt beagles]

warddog - what a wonderful post . actually its a good thing my dog aint union... cause i can fire him anytime he isnt getting the job done properly and he wont have any "business agent" to go cry to about keeping his job even though he isnt doing the work...LOL . maybe you could organize a local "rabbit runners" union for beagles and when im running my "scab" dogs, you can bring yours over and picket us and try to take our hunting spots if we dont get a union jump dog .

if you want to harrass me, at least be a man about it and call me, dont waste board space or ruin topics.

[blitzen]

While I agree with alot of what has been stated already and that the majority of the running ability lies with the hound itself I feel that it is up to the handler/trainer to recognize what or where the dog needs improving and to do this correctly it is helpful if you know your hounds line. For instance the line of hound I like best tends to develop slowly and if a young dog has the potential to become a great dog then I must bring them along correctly to get the most out of the hound (different training methods to build their confidence) not just running the dog and putting lots of hours on them, but working them according to what I feel they need to make them a top notch rabbit dog and when I get them to where I feel they are ready then I move them on. I am also sure their are other lines that don't require this much attention but this is the line that I like and choose to feed. This is just what works for me. Dave

[Incahoots]

For instance the line of hound I like best tends to develop slowly and if a young dog has the potential to become a great dog then I must bring them along correctly to get the most out of the hound (different training methods to build their confidence) not just running the dog and putting lots of hours on them,

I agree. I bring the best out of my dogs and I make them better dogs in the process. I'm given a great blue print but the blue print does not build the dog. You will never convince me how a dog is ran/handled doesn't make a huge impact when it's all said and done. I'm lucky that I consistantly get very good prospects but once it's in my hands it's my responsability to make the dog. I don't cut corners and sacrifice alot but when it's all said and done the time put in is always apparent. Dumping a pack of dogs out togeather will not make the dog. Soloing makes or breaks them bar none.

[voodoo]

IN MY OPINION SPEED IS IN THE EYES OF THE BEHOLDER.IF YOU RUN THE HOUND THE BLOOD LINE WILL!!!!!!! COME OUT .SLOW, MEDIUM ,FAST .YOU CAN'T TAKE A BRACE DOG & RUN IT IN THE MID WEST.OR A MIDWEST DOG.AND RUN IT IN BRACE .SO DIFFERENT BREEDS DIFFERENT SPEEDS. I SURE DO LIKE THIS POST I LIKE TO HERE DIFFERENT OPINIONS. KEEP GOING.
KEEP'EM RUNNING
PINE MT BEAGLES

[SMITTY1233]

Incahoots,

If your dog is a fast and accurate as you say he is I bet the reason you solo is so you can here a good race. A fast competitive dog will blow up a pack faster than anything if they are super fast and close. I have seen hound that go out by themselves on the worst condition and can run smooth and easy with no breakdowns but you put another two or three dogs in there with them and they look completely crazy.... It's all how competive they are in my mind. Speed is how fast they can run a rabbit, there competitive side is how crazy they will get in order to prove they are faster..... This is where the problems lies in blowing races up... I agree solo a dog is the best thing for them. They learn to run there own rabbit and can't depend on pack help. I love to solo my dogs as well...

[mike crabtree]

Blackdirt, I am union and proud of it.

[blackdirt beagles]

Blackdirt, I am union and proud of it.

good for you... im NOT and proud of that . WARDDOG was just taking a shot at me from another board... my post was mostly for him... no offense meant to you.
union/non-union... who cares! im probably as pro non-union as you are pro union, so lets leave it at that and enjoy beagles.