U.P. Cougars ?

[bucks better beagles]

Steve, I have no family or friends at the DNR. It just doesn't make sense to me for them to deny their (cougar) existence. I have not had a lot of negative experiences with them (DNR) but, I don't run into them vary often either. Generally, when I see an officer, he says hello and moves on. Matter of fact, I have a CCW and they have never asked to see it even though I tell them I have one each time there is an encounter. Maybe they like my smile (joke).

Bob

[Shotgun John]

They have been spotted in Amelia, Va. I seen a picture of one caught on a game camera lunging at a deer at a feeder. My sister in-law had one cross the road in front of her. If they are in Virginia, the can be any where.

[sgc]

Read the book "Stalked by a Mountain Lion" by Jo Deurbrouck. It is a real good book, hard to put down. It talks about Mountain Lion attacks in America. Quite a few in California. You can see how these attacks are on the rise.

[beaglerun]

Someone tell me what the DNR or any government agency has to gain by denying that there are or are not cougars in any state.

Maybe it's standard operating procedure or something. I just assumed they deny things so that they can't be held accountable. We have some of the same problems here in SC. I have met so many coon hunters who have said they have been running into black panthers/cougars at night. My pastor has called me twice about this large cat like animal that comes to the lake behind his house when the water is down. He has called DNR about it each time, and they told him he is mistaken a bobcat for something else. Their other explanation is to call Animal Control, because if it is what he says it is; then it must be a pet that someone has turned loose.

I know it has been more than 20 years ago when my dad and his friend walked up on three animals walking upright on their rear legs in the lowcountry of SC. It wasn't just that they saw them. The animals stood in the road and they watched each other for minutes. Finally, the three animals got down on all fours and walked off. They started to kill one just to find out what the animals were, but they were afraid to do so.

DNR declared that there were no black bears in the Low Country of SC, only in the mountains. About 6 years ago, a local barrier island and swamp area was developed. Since then people have been spotting, taking photographs, and hitting black bears along the new highway. Many people thought the bears must have migrated from the mountains of SC to the coast. DNR says thats not the case. According to them, black bears are natives to the low country of SC and that people are not starting to notice them because their population is rising.

Why the two diffirent stories, I don't know. All I know is my dad never doubted what he saw, and when the reports were confirmed he was not surprised.

BeagleRun

PS
For years they did the same thing with coyotes. When I reported one attacking my dogs about 5 years ago, they told me it couldn't have been a coyote because my description was too big. Now that people are killing them (One guy I know killed a 90 lb one) DNR says that these aren't coyotes, their coye-dogs. Therefore, we need to control the pet population.

[jmdown]

[steve w]

I first would like address the cougar in Michigan,here's a link to what the DNR has to say on the subject http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7-15 ... --,00.html I do not discount that a transient cougar could be here, Wisconsin DNR documented one there, that was reported just in the last few months in Michigan Outdoor News. I can't recall of any Michigan reports, I could have missed the one spoken of earlier. I'm not out to call anyone a liar. I really don't buy into the DNR planting them anymore than they planted the coyote. The way the coyote breeds and adapts they made thier way to every county in this state all on thier own.
As far as the DNR and thier attitude towards us I have seen it both ways. I know of one officer here in my area that appears callous and given what he deals with on a daily basis I can understand why, does it hurt my feelings cause he is not friendly or informitive, nope.I figure every Tom,Dick and Harry has asked him were the honey hole is and he's just acting the same as you or I would if we were in the same situation. Try asking for locations on this board or any other and see what kind of help you get from your fellow hunter.As long as I'm following the rules and have the license in my hand there is not much to talk to this guy about and we go our seperate ways with no problems. Then there is the other side of the coin, the guy that works the other game area I use regularly, could'nt meet a nicer guy. While he's still not giving up the latest hot spots he does use a little tact when dealing with the public and in one on one conversations is a down right nice guy. and has been helpfull.These guys are paid to enforce rules and if I'm one perch over or snagging that dieing salmon I would expect the ticket if caught, but I do get a half hour after sunset to hunt so if they write me a ticket for that one in 15 minutes I'm fighting it.LOL

[Buckeye Blues]

beaglerun,

There is alot of truth to that statement about coy-dogs. When yotes move into a new area they will bread with dogs to get the population started, but within several breeding seasons this stops and they eventually breed the dog half out. Once this happens you'll no longer see any yotes weighing anywhere close to 90 lbs. A yote on this side of the Mississippi is huge compared to the yotes of say Texas, but they still usually only top the scales at 40-50 lbs.

[big mike 50]

So if they don''t exist here can we just shoot them. The reason I ask is I deer hunt about 4 miles from where this photo was taken. 14 guys in our camp that sit all day dozens of wolf, but no cougars on camera and a buddy of mine runs coon where that Alpena photo was taken. He said that the Alpena photo was a hoax? Anybody know.

[Steve Mikkelson]

.

[Shotgun John]

If this photo is real you may not hear no twigs. This picture is from Leota Michigan ,wether it's real or not I couldn't tell you.

[bucks better beagles]

Steve M.

It would seem that you are saying that rules are made to be broken if you do not agree with them. Just asking? I never wear a seat belt and got a ticket for it. I don't like the helmet laws and got a ticket for it. I don't like the drug laws but, luckily, have never gotten a ticket for that.

Bob-Ticket payer in michigan

[Steve Mikkelson]

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[bucks better beagles]

Steve,

Good philosophy lesson...on which, I generally agree. Unnecessary law and intrusions into private lives are a giant bane of mine. However, I still don't understand why the DNR would lie about this? There is nothing to gain and all to lose. I have been told there are notices at areas around the painted rocks for tourist to beware of cougars because sightings have been reported.

I also agree with you on the reintroduction of wolves and coyotes. Especially the coyotes. Our rabbit population is almost decimated in the coyote areas around here. Couple that with the competition for food caused by turkeys (who are voracious and aggressive) and there are but few rabbits left in the state game areas.

Thanks for the discussion. Nough said.

Bob-I now carry a .45 cal derringer in Michigan. Hope I am fast to get to it.

[dave g]

I know there are a lot of honest people who say they saw cougars and I don't doubt them all. But I don't think that any of the cougars are wild. They are released or escaped pets. I don't know how far cougars travel but if they have no territories set why wouldn't an escaped pet go a long ways. And has anyone else noticed how all the michigan cougar sightings and so called cougar tracks seem to be in the summer. Wouldn't you think more tracks would be seen in the snow. And with all the bear and coon and bobcat and coyote hounds running wouldn't we get one treed and on the local new and papers yet. Or even a dead one hit by a car. Heck they treed a wolverine in the thumb. And a few years back a black bear got hit by a car on 75 in flint.
Now a cougar with a collar sounds like a pet got loose or a top secret hound training project to me. I would think the ones that know if there were wild cougars would be the biologists not the dnr officers that check our licenses and bag limits.

Later, dave

[bucks better beagles]

Dave G.

My point exactly. There was a guy lived in my neighborhood who kept a 300 pound bear for training his dogs. You guessed it, it broke through its enclosure and was gone. He was out of town and by the time he returned, sightings of bear were everywhere. He finally got his dogs after it and ran it down but it surely caused excitement.

Bob-Michigan