Measuring Hounds

[Scott Green]

Everyone knows the rules. If you bring a dog that is over 15" and it measures out, dont blame the person that had your dog measured out. You brought it, paid your entry fee and took the risk of entering a dog that you knew could measure over 15". Why should ARHA have to change the rules to suit your dog?

[beagler282]

ALL dogs that are registered in the ARHA Progressive Pack Division have to be measured at the time someone signs their hound up with the NKC.If the dog measures over at that time it can't be registered with the NKC.If the hound goes to get certified it has to be measured before it can be certified to move up to R.CH or GR.R.CH.Anytime the hound is measured whether it be for registration or certification the hounds size has to be written down on the form by the breed inspector.Size does not matter when it comes to running a rabbit but it does matter when competeing in certain organizations.Not only has Little Pack had a problem with this but also Progressive Pack.I myself have had people ask for my hound to be measured and I did measure under.I don't see anything wrong with people having hounds that are taller than 15'' if that is what they want to have.I prefer 14-14 1/2'' hounds myself and will cull the smaller ones.If you want to play be prepared to pay!

[yellowdog]

i agree with all ...if you run a hound over 15 you are rollin the dice boys...i could care less if i am running against a 16 inch hound or not i run smaller dogs but that dont bug me one bit...1 hour if mine cant keep up for one hour with those horses i dont need him anyhow...run what ya like but dont cry the blues when somebody calls your card and your dog is measured out...jmho...

[bradadkins]

[MGB]

Measure before they run. Keeps everybody honest.

[tommy shouse]

15 is 15 rules are rules in any sport

[Hunter]

OK my question is then why 15 when across the pond where our hounds come from they see 16 as breed standard?
http://www.thebeagleclub.co.uk/
http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/item/15
This site evens says not to be less than 13" So maybe we should cull all hounds that are under 13" as well
http://www.nzkc.org.nz/br416.html

Also you never hear mention of size in the coon hound world. A coon hound is a coon hound wether it is 45 pounds or 145 pounds as long as it runs the coons.
Maybe they should change the purpose of Field Trials to keeping the beagle useful as a rabbit-hunting hound as long as it is 15" or less.
In order to keep things fair maybe we should only run dogs that are of equal size and have been clocked with a radar gun sight chasing a rabbit to make sure none have more foot than another maybe with a 1 mph variance.
jmo, Hunter
ps
I have seen hounds pick up for too much foot in arha pp. Looks like the same type of thing. The only difference is that there was no rule for that but they did it anyhow to get rid of the dogs that they could not compete with.
ps ps Looks like progression of things
First you print up rules
Then you make up rules
Then unfortunately stuff like this is next
http://americanbeagler.huntingboards.co ... hp?t=28598

[BeaglerJay]

I think some people take measuring hounds to serious. I have a male dog that is a full 15 inch when you drop the bar on his back it stops at 15 but he has also been measured out 2 times in the last 3 years he was an 8th of an inch over after the guy took 10 minutes measuring him and stacking him up making him stand like a world show dog but I don't to get mad about it because personally i think it's funny it's almost like people try to measure him out because they don't wanna run against him? But I don't know i could be wrong I just thought i would ad my 2 cents!

Jay

[Hunter]

The topic has been for disqualifying hounds based on breaking the rule based on breed standard and measuring them.
Now after looking at the UKC breed standard for beagles it looks as though there might be more reasons than just this to revoke a hounds registration thus he would no longer be able to enter trials.

"Disqualifications

Unilateral or bilateral cryptorchid. Viciousness or extreme shyness. Over 15 inches in height. Overshot bite. Undershot bite. (Overshot or undershot is defined as having a visible gap between the upper and lower teeth.) It is recommended that Beagles exhibiting these disqualifications not be used for breeding nor be U.K.C. registered."

Looking at this it looks like UKC only wants to promote complete dogs.
So why would they want to give a CH title to a dog with any of these undesirable features. It would appear that the dogs need more than just their size checked before the hunt especially considering the heading of the section quoted which I put in bold. In order to promote completely qualified hounds we must disqualify hounds for Unilateral or bilateral cryptorchid, viciousness or extreme shyness, overshot bite,and undershot bite.

jmo, Hunter

[SilverZuk]

I think if a beagle is AKC registered then it is full blooded. Do not understand why it would matter if it goes over the 15" mark.
jmo, Hunter

First, You don't think there are people out there that doctor AKC papers?
There are crooks everywhere. AKC doesn't mean anymore than any other registry. AKC doesn't make it a beagle anymore than it does a german shepard.

15" is the rule that was set by ARHA.
I am pretty sure there are some states where it is illegal to rabbit hunt with a dog over 15" (South Carolina I think). It is also the upper limit on the generally accepted breed standard.

As far as what does an 1" make in a dog.
Look at two dogs.
One 13" and one 15"

The 15" dog is 15% taller.
Lets put this perspective in human terms.
One guy is 6-foot tall and the other would be 5' 2"

So if you are sticking to the "it's a registered beagle - run it" mindset. Petition the ARHA to remove height limits, just require AKC papers.
See where that lands the usefulness of a rabbit dog in 10 years when the whole pack is around 17".

Look at where ARHA hounds are today. I'll be the first to tell you that mine are not ideal rabbit dogs. They are too fast, put too much pressure on the rabbit which causes the rabbit to break out of its normal circle, hit a hole, or keeps you from getting a shot because the dogs are about to catch the rabbit. I have to question my sanity about hunting with these dogs when I have a medium speed gip at the house that keeps the track between her front legs and keeps the rabbit just hopping along. I already know which is the ideal rabbit dog.

I like my "race dogs" but the next ones I get I plan to be a little slower, because I want a rabbit dog first.

[SilverZuk]

If they wanted to get serious about 15" they would measure the winners pack at each hunt.

The bottom line is that not that many people care, and ARHA makes money on hounds entering trials regardless of size. So I can see why they would be slow to exclude a portion of their existing customers.

They leave it up to handler at the casting stake to make the call.
Step up to the plate and call it, or keep your mouth shut about a dog being over 15".

It is up to the owner to enter a dog over 15" and take the risk of being measured out. I don't see the reason for anymore rules than what is already there. They already have the height issue covered and policed.
I don't want to spend an extra day at a big hunt because they had to measure all hounds before the hunt. I don't see the need to waste my time at every hunt I place in measuring my dogs that aren't even close to 15".

[wildcatfan0309]

i would never asked to have a dog measured
whats it matter weither you get beat by a 10 inch beagle or a 16 inch beagle
you still got beat

[Hunter]

NOTICE the term...
DisqualificationS
with an S on the end.
So if you all are promoting the rules lets promote them all not just the 15 inch, include the rest.
1 testicle,
shyness, viciousness,
overbite, and underbite

lets switch gears everyone has beat the 15" rule and preached rules so lets get with the program or consider adjusting the rules.
cya, Hunter

So if you are sticking to the "it's a registered beagle - run it" mindset. Petition the ARHA to remove height limits, just require AKC papers.

No I am sticking to the idea that if where the dogs originated from consider 16" to be Breed Standard than we should too.

[Pine MT Beagle Runner]

My earlier reply was in error. Thanks dogwhisperer for correcting my mistake. I went back and reread the LP rules and what I thought I had read was not there. Sometimes I mess up that way. Guess from now on, I'll go back and reread to make sure I am stating things correctly.


Chris Chandler

[Pine Mt Beagles]

CHRIS
PINE MT BEAGLES HAS BEEN A REGISTERED KENNEL FOR ABOUT 20 YEARS AND IT'S LOCATED ON PINE MT 12 MILES FROM PINEVILLE KY THANKS I'M SURE YOU DIDN'T KNOW IT. THANK'S

KEEP'EM RUNNING
PINE MT BEAGLES