How Important is close check work?

[bucks better beagles]

No Dingus. To clarify, no dog is going to lead a chase all the time unless you have one good dog and a lot of me tooers. But, what I want is dogs that will try to get the front end and are not willing to lolly gag around surfing the pack. If I have, as an example, 4 dogs in a race. I would like each of them to ideally get 25% of the crossings that I observe over the long haul. On any given day, one of them will do better than the others but they should all be trying. In just about any person's pack, there will be one dog that is better than the others and that is OK as long as the others are trying.

Harner, In my scenario I was referring to GOOD dogs in both categories. If your line dog explodes out of the check as you say, fine, my swinger will get on his ass in a heart beat. But if your line dog hangs too long, my swinger will make him look real bad. Also, any dog that yields in my world is a dead dog. If your line dog dominates my swinger, I will look for a better dog. They must never give up or come in off a chase, Never. Laying under the truck just cannot happen under any circumstances.

"Close Check Work" of course is subjective. When I say "swinger" I am not talking about a dog that is hundreds of yards away trying to find a check. I am simply talking about one that does not stop at the point of loss and try to find a scent. It may and often is, only a few yards off the loss but he must be working his utmost to straighten out the track. Then, when he gets it, he has to go with his head up and running to catch.

Augerhead: Boring? That is what Jack Danials is for. To keep it from getting boring. Just kidding of course.

[hard on a check]

Speed with Control = Winners.

[augerhead]

Buck, Sounds like me and you like the same style hound. We should hook up and let the cream come to the top,but dont bring any second stringers. Could be alot of fun.

[jlcopeland]

jlcopeland wrote:
bucks better beagles wrote:
Speed kills. Always has and always will. If a dog swings, gets it and can run it when he gets it, that checker will always be playing back-up. I hate back-up singers and back-packers.

my sentiments exactly unless youre the lead dog the view never changes just say no to butt sniffers and inside out check dogs playing catch up

What you have referenced here are the ones I won't feed because on the snow in a typical Michigan winter this type of dog can't circle cottontails 3 or 4 times by themselves so I can get a shot at them And if they can't do that they are of no use to me. Windsplitters sure are fun to watch in the spring time but they are also the most aggrivating to watch all winter while rabbit season is open!

The dogs i referenced will circle the rabbits also only difference is these rabbits dont stop and scratch behind their ears if i wanted a slow boring sport i would take up golf dogs that want the front is the only kind to feed

[bucks better beagles]

Augerhead, you are welcome to come to my place at any time and don't come a limpin yourself. I don't have any second stringers or jr. varsity. I call those fertilizer.

[Alabama John]

These type of discussions held locally are a dog traders dream.
When you come to buy a dog, it will be exactly like we like best on here.
Bet he takes notes!

[DINGUS MAN]

Thank God., that I raise my own and dont need to buy.

[bucks better beagles]

Alabama: These type of discussions held locally are a dog traders dream.
When you come to buy a dog, it will be exactly like we like best on here.
Bet he takes notes!

I don't know what the implication is here but I buy a lot of dogs. How a person represents them and how they really are, are always two different things. I only buy if a dog can improve upon what I have. I only sell if they can not.

Dingus: I raise my own too. I like to get the best bred dog I can find at about 8 months old and go from there. I find that other people's training methods don't always agree with my own. My records indicate that I have owned 1546 dogs in my lifetime. Of those, only hand full were real rabbit dogs. I have had every "name brand" out there and would love to try one of yours if you ever let any go.

[Alabama John]

Bucks,
You are no dog trader!
that was supposed to be amusing, but, true enough around here.
Go to a dog trader, I mean one that is at every trade day and there are lots of them in this area you could go to every week. Several men with 20 or more beagles each and listen how they will ask all about what do you like then seem to have just the dog that does exactly that.
No trial of course, cash only.

Best to let him tell you about each dog without knowing what you are thinking or reading your facial or body expressions. WE teach that in the 2nd grade in school. Dog trading 101.

[DINGUS MAN]

Dingus: I raise my own too. I like to get the best bred dog I can find at about 8 months old and go from there. I find that other people's training methods don't always agree with my own. My records indicate that I have owned 1546 dogs in my lifetime. Of those, only hand full were real rabbit dogs. I have had every "name brand" out there and would love to try one of yours if you ever let any go.

Bucks, I havent sold a pup in I guess 15 years but if I decide to sale one I will let you know. My dogs have been line bred since the 1970's directly out of dingus. They are dingus, top and bottom. They want satisfy some and a few they might but they are what I like and I like what they do. Thanks

[NeilKimbrel7]

I disagree in the only dog that counts is in the front. I like my hound to have the front but they got other roles they can fill throughout the day. Hunting Packs of dogs will run better than trial packs because hunting dogs work dog vs rabbit. Trial it's dog vs dog. Almost always more breakdowns. The best packs can have several dominent dogs but more often than not the best pack you can have is one front end dog, a couple that can compete but run 2nd and 3rd, and finally an anchor dog( a dog just fast enough to keep up but is flawless everywhere else strong nose, good line control, extreme hunt, jump power are all a must for me to keep an anchor dog. Also for the ppl that think the view never changes unless your in the front....once again is false. None of the fastest footed hounds I know can hold the front for any amount of time. A strong med/fast powerful check dog will run as much front. Every time they get a check guess what, they are in the front. They have to solo run to catch once they get it but when the fastest hounds pass they'll blow it up again. I like all good dogs. The problem with minusing dogs for style is it's very subjective to opinion. To me there are faults and there are style differences. Faults are backtrack and dogs that constantly overrun. Anything that can cause downtime in a race. Style is swingin reachin stayin tight whatever when they don't have the rabbit. I say whatever works best that day is best. I won't cry and say u cheat if you beat me. With the dog I'm lookin for an Extreme swinger will beat them some, extreme line dogs will beat them some, but 90% of the time you better pack a lunch because you'll have it to do. Jmo

[Lance]

My records indicate that I have owned 1546 dogs in my lifetime. Of those, only hand full were real rabbit dogs. I have had every "name brand" out there and would love to try one of yours if you ever let any go.

That many dogs and only a handful of "real rabbit dogs"????? Maybe it's your training style that is the problem

[DINGUS MAN]

IMO a good dog is a good dog. A good dog can trial and hunt. If they cant....whats the point? Either they can get the job done or they cant. Once again JMO

[wireman252]

My records indicate that I have owned 1546 dogs in my lifetime. Of those, only hand full were real rabbit dogs. I have had every "name brand" out there and would love to try one of yours if you ever let any go.

That many dogs and only a handful of "real rabbit dogs"????? Maybe it's your training style that is the problem

Ok maybe this is none of my business, but I consider Buck a good beagling buddy. The statement he made, has nothing to do with his training stlye. This man runs everyday and knows very well what he wants in a hound. He has a very big measuring stick is all. There are far too many "AVERAGE" beagles out there and he's seen plenty of them. Buck is like many of us on here. He is ALWAYS looking for that ABOVE AVERAGE hound. Hence the "only a hand full" statement. From what I've gathered ,they must have the whole package for Buck to keep 'em, and they gotta WANT the front or at least be trying to get it when they don't have it.

[bucks better beagles]

Lance, my training style, no. My expectations, yes. I don't sell culls, I cull them. I only keep the top 10% that I can find. Many pretty good dogs come through my kennel but only the best get to eat this expensive dog food. I am not saying my way of doing things is the right way only that I have been at it a long time and know what I want. I am not even saying they are the best around but they will run with you and better represent themselves pretty good.

I am always looking for new blood, open colored, under 1 year old, male, 15" or better, well put together, shows speed and hunt, price/based on the dog.