who promotes the best all around RABBIT DAWG?????

[briarshakersdaddy]

Hey Josh quit taking you deer runners and you wont have a problem LOL Just funning Josh. A deer dog is about as much good for rabbit hunting as my wife's house dog.[Miniature German Schnauzer] But the house dog has hard hunt when she gets out side. More than some Beagles. Just dont know what she is hunting for [like some beagles] Trust me I have owned some of them just not for long. Have not realy seen any format that realy promotes a all around rabbit dog like the grade dogs we hunted with 40 years ago. But then there was a whole lot more rabbits then than now. Try to go out now even in your so called honey hole and jump 30 rabbits and harvest 20 to 25 of them before noon. Most of the little faimley farms are gone or growed up till they dont have the right cover for rabbits. Also didn't have Yotes and hawks and owls were not protected. all you had was a few foxes and an mink once in a while and not a million wild house cats. But as you get older every thing from the past gets better. In Bath and Fleming counties you did not need a dog would be so many rabbits up at one time they didnt know which one to run.

[wildcatfan0309]

Hey Josh quit taking you deer runners and you wont have a problem LOL Just funning Josh. A deer dog is about as much good for rabbit hunting as my wife's house dog.[Miniature German Schnauzer] But the house dog has hard hunt when she gets out side. More than some Beagles. Just dont know what she is hunting for [like some beagles] Trust me I have owned some of them just not for long. Have not realy seen any format that realy promotes a all around rabbit dog like the grade dogs we hunted with 40 years ago. But then there was a whole lot more rabbits then than now. Try to go out now even in your so called honey hole and jump 30 rabbits and harvest 20 to 25 of them before noon. Most of the little faimley farms are gone or growed up till they dont have the right cover for rabbits. Also didn't have Yotes and hawks and owls were not protected. all you had was a few foxes and an mink once in a while and not a million wild house cats. But as you get older every thing from the past gets better. In Bath and Fleming counties you did not need a dog would be so many rabbits up at one time they didnt know which one to run.

dont think you have no room to talk about deer runners
lol

[kentucky mobster 08]

it take 6 win at three didnt clubs to make a grand in lp.1 win and 100 points to make lp ch then 5 more win at three different clubs to make a grand.i know the different in akc and nkc.no i had not yet attended a akc hunt yet mainly because they are not very many around here.was going to a derby,but my dog was to old by one month.now i got a dog that can and will run in akc derby.i will finish him in akc.

my point is
akc,nkc,etc. is a business they are about making money first.i got one of the best gun dogs around.he love the gun.he doesnt run no trash,good foot,big mouth and pretty clean.i had a litter of pups out of him.most people was only concern about his pedigree not his abiltiy.i offer to show him in the field i dont see too many people making that offer. most people think if its not a reggie,primetime or another big name dog its not worth having.my dog was a gun dog first.i think it funny when you hear people talking about someone dogs,saying he got some of the best gun dogs in the country,but they cant win no trial.then they want to get on here talk about whats a rabbit dog.there a different between rabbit dog and trial dog. akc,nkc they promote a title and a style,nothing else.

[Pine Mt Beagles]

HEY GUY'S
I THINK IF WE MADE A FORMAT TO FIT THE HOUNDS AND NOT TRY TO BREED A DOG FOR A FORMAT WE WOULD REALLY IMPROVE THE BREED AS A RABBIT HOUND,,,,,,,,
PINE MT BEAGLES

[wildhare2]

Hey wildcatfan,
was this at Wurtland?
I think it might have been and if it was the Judges didn't know that all of those dogs in the winners pack were on that deer run. I got 3 or 4 and brought them back within 15 mins and that is the rule. I know that the judges said the two or three dogs that didn't go or came back couldn't hardly run a rabbit and weren't doing very well when the pack got back in and started running. I don't know if this is the trial or not, but the rule is you have 15 mins to get them back, or they are scratched. Normally if they are running deer you wouldn't be able to call them off and get them back. I've seen alot of hounds that will go with the pack, but not be running the deer. Don't get me wrong that's just as bad as running the deer. JMO

[wildcatfan0309]

yep
i didnt say that all the dogs that placed ran the deer

[wildhare2]

No, I am telling you that all of them were on that race. They may not have all been actually running it, but were all gone at one point. I actually caught 3 or 4 of the top 5 that placed right at the road. It happens every year when Paul Kormony shows up with his deer runners. I could have caught his, but I knew they started that deer race so I let them go right by me. The front 4 or 5 were smokin that doe. All of the front runners of that deer race got picked up. I knew when we went to that hill we were gonna have a deer run. At the end of the hunt 4 dogs went off the 30 foot cliff right next to the road. I don't know if I will run there again or not. I don't like all those drop offs.

[wildcatfan0309]

No, I am telling you that all of them were on that race. They may not have all been actually running it, but were all gone at one point. I actually caught 3 or 4 of the top 5 that placed right at the road. It happens every year when Paul Kormony shows up with his deer runners. I could have caught his, but I knew they started that deer race so I let them go right by me. The front 4 or 5 were smokin that doe. All of the front runners of that deer race got picked up. I knew when we went to that hill we were gonna have a deer run. At the end of the hunt 4 dogs went off the 30 foot cliff right next to the road. I don't know if I will run there again or not. I don't like all those drop offs.

oh ok sorry i miss understood you

[danny vansickle]

yeah,i wasnt there but i heard all about it the next day,that was the large pack trial that cash won wasn't it?

[wildcatfan0309]

yeah,i wasnt there but i heard all about it the next day,that was the large pack trial that cash won wasn't it?

yeah
cash looked awesome

[rock crusher]

I know there are good dogs in every bracket but on the other hand there are sorry dogs in every bracket. iI run lp cause thats the only trials that are around here.However i have run in a demo akc large pack hunt which was ok but the dog that won it was a mouthy ass dog.Then you run the lp hunts and some of the judgeing just sucks.I wish we had two judges with no affilation with any of the owners,handlers or dogs.Then you have dogs that swing out 75 to 100 yards running with a line control dog which is no comparison. I bought 2 dogs that swing just to run in some lp hunt which aint near as fun to hear or watch run but we all do things to have fun and nobody likes loosing all the time> wish i had a midwest hunt close by just to see how its done!

ROCK CRUSHER

DO N IT LOUD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Jamie Rice]

There's no 15 minute rule in SPO rules! The only time rule in AKC is if dogs are pursuing a rabbit, a hound has five minutes to pack else it's demerited. However a beagle is a pack animal! If a dog isn't packing then he/she should be picked up. Judges are there to find the best individual dog and onward through the top five. Only thing about deer in AKC rules is it's to be demerit. Funny shouldn't any other off game be as well? A demerit can be minor or severe. Personally I feel any off game should be a SEVERE DEMERIT resulting in automatic ejection. While not specifically spelled out, there is a rule the provide for this. That being ANYTHING THING DISRUPTIVE TO A PACK MUST BE PICKED UP. I think everyone can agree off game is as disruptive as anything.

All formats have their pros and their cons. Honestly can anyone say one is any better than the other? Truth is we show allegiance to what we run that's only to be expected. And too many folks wear their allegiance on their sleeves and get their panties in a wad when someone points out a flaw to them. MOST HAVE SOME EXCUSE TO USE WHEN THEIR GREATER THAN GREAT CAN'T WIN OR PLACE IN SOME OTHER FORMAT. Seems like every three to four years some new format or registry is created because Tom, Dick, or Harry's dogs can't place or win in what's already out there. Rather than creating a format to fit a dog, people should breed and train dogs more so to fit the format if they're so concerned with trialing. The formats aren't flawed it's the people that's creating the rules and judging the dogs.

I trial SPO primarly, but that doesn't mean I think it's better than any other. Personally all formats and registries should have one thing in common... that being their champions should prove they can solo their own rabbit before the dog is rewarded their title. And if they fail they shouldn't get a second chance! There shouldn't be any stop watch in beagling either. Only time most real hunters care about is sunrise and sunset.

There's only thing that promotes a rabbit dog. That's being in the field with your friends and family gun hunting! Sad thing there's more internet beagles and ribbon chasers today than they are hunters. That's why you continue to hear several people continuously say I wish they would start placing rabbit dogs. Judges don't know how to when they aren't hunting and don't even know what the one is in the first place!

[briarshakersdaddy]

Have Ran In all three registery's all about the same some great dogs some duds. Just a part of life. Still think if in can be trailed you should be able to hunt it. In stead of trying to say which is the best format we need to all band toghter against the anti hunting fractions in this country before we end up like they did in england with out the right to persue game with our beagles. Does any one realy care which format promotes the best all around rabbit dog. Run them all suport all the clubs in your area make our voice one a strong one agains the ones who would take our rights away. Agree with Fuzz if it disrupt's the pack for what ever reason it should be picked up no matter who owns it. If mine does something wrong pick it up. don't field trial like it is a matter of life or death just enjoy your self and keep striving for that perfect dog thats how you inprove the breed dont be kennel blind to your dogs faults [ every one of them has some] just relize which ones you can live with.

[TC]

GOOD POST Jamie and I agree!!!!!!
The DEER thing was touched on at the Advanced Seminar and What was said was as to the Disruption of the pack A judge can pick The Dogs up at ANY time he thinks they are Disruptive to the pack..
They also touched on the fact that these dogs Are pack animals and in the instance of a deer or off game race Any Dog that Comes back to the Handlers And it is determined that there was a off Game race that those that came back Would be and Should be allowed to Continue!!!!
There has been a lot of Dogs picked up For Quiting When actually they Were just coming back because they knew better!!!!

[dogwhisperer]

.Then you run the lp hunts and some of the judgeing just sucks.I wish we had two judges with no affilation with any of the owners,handlers or dogs.

my question is this how could you run a hunt with 2 judges??? You figure if you only had 5 casts of dogs right theres 5 hours not counting travel time to and from spots.Also where could you find judges that know anything about judging when they are not affilated with owners handlers or dogs.Just dont see how its possible..Eventually one of those judges will be affilated with someone or a dog.. just a question.....???????