Rule Change

Adam M. O'Donnell · Post by **Adam M. O'Donnell** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 11:37 am

I agree the food may have gotten better, and pups may be reaching their full (height) potential during their growing period. But I also believe the Beagle has been bred in the states for who knows how long, without a major size issue. Sure there are dogs produced every day that go over 15". That's no big deal. But the rule in any good old American Field trial, no matter which registry you choose to run in, is nothing larger than 15" may participate!
You guys have said "Everyone has noticed there's a lot of big hounds around today"................
It doesn't take a dummy to figure out what trial to attend if your hound is over 15" Obviously ARHA LP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You guys about neuter a guy for calling for a measure! And then you wonder why people are shocked at the#of 15"+ hounds at these trials!
That's because ARHA doesn't enforce the 15" inch rule unless asked to!And theres hell to pay if you have the nerve to ask for a measure!
I said it before, and I'll say it again............
Measure them before every trial! If 40% of the attendance drops then I'd say it's fair to asume that 40% of the ARHA LP hounds in these trials would measure out and their owners know it![/b]

pete young · Post by **pete young** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 11:49 am

This is a strange thread. I really have mixxed emotions on this one. I don't like the stigma of running an oversized dog, but I will admit that if you stand my bluetick up and pose him all pretty he will measure 15 1/4. I will continue taking him to the trials because you would be hard pressed to get him to stand that tall. I know going in that if someone has him measured that he may get measured out. That's the chance I take. On the other hand, I go to win! I try to be a good sport about losing, but I don't like it! If I show up, I will have something that I think can compete. You can bet on that. That being said, there are a few small dogs that can compete with the big ones, but they are as RARE as hens teeth. I didn't make the rules and I wasn't the one that let them get "bent". I may be perpetuating the problem to some extent, but I do play to win and will push the limits of the rules to some extent. I will not cheat anyone nor will I be cheated without speaking my peace, but you have to play on an even playing feild to have a chance to compete. I compare it to a good poker hand. If I get to use 6 cards to make my hand and you only get to use 5, there will not be many days that you beat me. If everyone else is using 6 cards then I will too! This was my first year at the World and didn't place a dog. I didn't get cheated. I just didn't get the running that I needed to have a chance to win. There were some good dogs in my casts and would have had a hard time winning even if I did get the running I needed.

I don't really care if they change the rules or not! My only thing is this. If you are going to enforce the rules to the letter of the law sometimes, then do it everytime! If you are going to let one dog slide, then let them all slide. It's not fair that one guy can run a big dog and everyone is afraid to measure him, but let a newcomer show up with no reputation preceeding him and BAM! He gets the measuring stand eviction, because there is no social reprocutions from his buddies. It's not right. Be a man and stand for something. Don't let who is holding the lead determine whether or not you are going to enforce the rules or be a man and let your dog determine who wins the cast and not your petty selective rule enforcement!

J.C. Blair · Post by **J.C. Blair** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 12:01 pm

Well said Pete, I wished everyone could have the same kind of outlook that you do on things.

Brian joiner when you decide to run something other than your mouth , i may listen to you , but make no mistake I DO NOT LIKE YOU , so why dont you take them grade dogs to you little jr beagle board & let us fight amongst our selves, if we need a moderator we got stoney . have a great day loser

Jimmie now I know why we are such good friends, we think a lot alike. Jimmie does the name Redtick seem to ring a bell?? lol

yellowdog · Post by **yellowdog** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 12:04 pm

measuring aint exactly failsafe boys...i have seen several hounds that have been trained to measure in....almost every trial i have run in there is big dogs and i run a 13.5 ....so my point is there is gonna be big hounds whether you measure them or not.."a cheat will always figure out a way to cheat"....as long as it is competition there will always be a few guys out there that will push the limits and find all the loopholes they can to win...i dont personally care for that kind of person ...one that will put his hounds health on the back burner for a trophy ...not worth it to me.....anyway boys this aint a productive post for anybody plus any young trialers that read this will never get into trials then it will be a dying sport......run your hounds get them geared up and then ya wont have to worry about an hour worth of running with a foxhound...the rule aint gonna change cause the cheaters will just teach their hounds to measure in one way or another....go run some hounds...

[/quote]

island ridge hounds · Post by **island ridge hounds** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 2:04 pm

yellowdog, this post has got out of hand but you can just about go thru
it and find out which ones have the oversized hounds. just run'em in the
briars that usually evens the score. are you coming to columbus sat.
i think they had some rain last night so the running should be awesome.
hope to see you'll there.

buddy wall

yellowdog · Post by **yellowdog** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 2:22 pm

me or my wife one are gonna try to make it...hope to see ya there.

TC · Post by TC » Fri Apr 07, 2006 2:42 pm

.

i have seen several hounds that have been trained to measure in

you will always see this BUT if a Judge is properly trained on HOW to measure NO amount of training will get them By make the owner stand aside and then Properly measure the dog and the tell of the tape will cast the bigger dogs out.
me personally I dont have a problem Callin a measure on a dog if it s BIG its Big all there is to that. 15" is the standard and the rule Now that bein said I have SEEN a dog that will measure a 1/4 inch either way on any given day.[/b]

blackdirt beagles · Post by **blackdirt beagles** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 3:57 pm

thanks jimmie, i feel the same about you and "top pup". no wander the arha slipped this year... its full of guys who promote cheating.
time for me to go to work for the weekend... you boys have fun trying to justify bending the rules (cheating).

yellowdog · Post by **yellowdog** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 4:04 pm

JIMMIE ABSHIRE · Post by **JIMMIE ABSHIRE** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 4:15 pm

Let us know how that 10 month old grade dog super stud , turns out for ya - Believe me all of us need a good laugh oh yea before i leave for the weekend one other thing , remember your freezer full of trophies , well brian my freezer is full too .Guess what else? So is my house and they are BIG they also look good beside my akc ribbons , oh thats right you cant win akc events with grade dogs can ya

ya

. The next time you want to jump in MY conversation , remember i dont give a flip about you . or them culls cuz

blackdirt beagles · Post by **blackdirt beagles** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 5:16 pm

thanks jimmie...but i can go to any trial i want as all but one of my dogs are akc. and my super stud is doing fine... thanks for your concern. didnt know this was your conversation...lol. i though the shoopman guy posted the topic. while im at work, please make me a list of topics that arent yours that i can post on. thanks.

diamondp · Post by **diamondp** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 7:04 pm

what the heck.I thought SIZE mattered .oh, we are talking hounds . This has been the highlight of my week.I tried for the last 3 yrs to convince the powers that be to measure all hounds ,measure the top 10 ,or just the finals.I sent letters ,made phone calls ,and pushed my point until it was useless.Del morgan will have nothing instituted that lowers entries .oh yeah I have seen big dogs measured in in akc at every trial i have attended,they are in all aspects of trialing .Good luck trying to change anything, I couldn't .
chris

J.C. Blair · Post by **J.C. Blair** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 10:24 pm

Boy I wished they would let ol Redtick back in here

Hey Chris,
I agree with you, there are a lot of people that have been tryin to get the powers that be, to make the rules on measuring before the hunt or in the final pack so to speak. My old club back a few years tried to get this in the works to send it and it got rejected. Maybe they'll do it, maybe not. Well guys I'm off in the morning to chase a trophy with my little male. Good luck to anyone trialing tomorrow.

dawgydawg67 · Post by **dawgydawg67** » Sat Apr 08, 2006 6:11 am

Jimmy
Bottom line...............the SIZE of the dog NEVER beat me, it was just plain better than mine. Bob Dawes

randy37 · Post by **randy37** » Sat Apr 08, 2006 6:11 am

they can change the hunt format from two hours to one and then a half hour winners pack,and not effect the numbers,and that in my opinion was a bad move"for the breed" measuring the hounds would be a good thing but it doesnt seem like the rule will change,and leaving the call up to hadlers to have a hound measured is wrong.