What 3 bloodlines you would have in your kennel

[Ron Conroe]

thats what makes the beagle world go round, everybody runs what they like. thats what makes it fun and interesting, you get to see diffrent stuff go. find what you like and run it.

[warddog]

Gary A,
That is correct but our potlickers couldn't keep a track going for nothing. We had one female get over into Joe's group as she saw we were going to the truck and snuck around us to get into their action. Sure glad they caught her as I wouldn't have wanted her to slow down their chase. Never got the names of the other fellas but sounded like they had a better run then we had. I'm thinking the female headed to them so she could run with dogs that could keep a track going. LOL

[Lone Pine Beagles]

Sanford,

You say "jeep" is ausable bred.
Looking at his pedigree he looks to be 1/2 colbyhill, northway, branko, swartz bigtime, and ausable.
I like his breeding.

LPB

[TrlBustinBeagle]

Lone Pine if Jeep is 1/2 Colby Hill then he is another 1/4 Ausable blood. So he is more of that blood then the northway, branko, swartz bigtime. If you ask me he is a total OUTCROSS

[South Woods kennel]

Ausable and colby hill are very similar bloodlines.

[NCPatch]

I have try'ed most all of the fast lines Frank Reese and the gay hounds ran on one side of the mountain behind where I grew up and me and my grade hounds ran on the other . He ran fox with his and they would run on my side sometimes and mine would join in there were no shock collars back then . So I ended up with some grade cross gays that you could not break off fox. Thank goodness there wer'nt any deer around here then. Now to answer your ??? PATCH PATCH PATCH!

[thornie]

Most of the dogs in my kennel are 2nd or 3rd generation Ole Bad Cliff. I have a female now out Branko's Red River Runner x Mistsou Argentil Stiker female, I really like. I also have 2 four month old pups that I'm really likeing right now. Cliff x Shakerag x Weir Creek bred. But most of all the Ole Bad Cliff line has served me well.

[sanfordssj]

Most of the dogs in my kennel are 2nd or 3rd generation Ole Bad Cliff. I have a female now out Branko's Red River Runner x Mistsou Argentil Stiker female, I really like. I also have 2 four month old pups that I'm really likeing right now. Cliff x Shakerag x Weir Creek bred. But most of all the Ole Bad Cliff line has served me well.

Gotta love the Shakerag stuff have you had the chance to see the lemon at Roys yet? Let me know what you think of her Thornie.

[Shady Grove Beagles]

Sandfordssj
In one of your posts on this thread you mentioned that the hounds of today are faster and stronger and that the Ninja blood was too far back and thus not of much influence if I get your post right.Ninja has been dead since '95 and granted "HE" is getting further and further removed in today's pedigrees that you see.But,I strongly disagree that his influence in producing the traits so many liked in him can not be maintained through selective linebreeding.It goes without saying that Jack of all Trades was a top reproducer and his son Ninja proved to have the same abilities to produce hounds of the better kind.Ever notice how often Branko's Conna [ Ninja's sister ] appears in the pedigrees of most of Branko's best hounds?How about Leroy Brown [Ninja's brother ]? Reggie's mother is a result of a Ninja half brother and sister cross.I.F.C. Beavercreek Blue Max has Ninja as his grandsire top and great grandsire on the bottom.I'm not saying you'll get Ninja but, I do believe that with proper selection and linbreeding you can use dogs bred this way to maintaine charecteristics and type of an outstanding hound and the family of hounds that he came from and reproduced.
If you ever get the chance read"Call of the Hounds" by Del Cameron.Del pioneered professional bear and lion hunting in the northern Rockies and was the only full time professional lion and bear guide in Montana for many years.For almost 50 years he bred,raised and trained his own line of registered hounds.
In the last chapter of his book "The Legacy Lives On"he talks at length about breeding his "family" of hounds and I quote "It becomes a blending of charecteristics from various individuals to achieve in one hound that which perhaps was once in several.Once established,this blend continues in the decendants as long as judicious selection is maintained.
Usually it is considered that puppies recieve little from ancestors beyond the grandparents.But I have seen traits in my hounds that were common in ancestors seven or eight generations back.This merely indicates that the foundation stock used in any strain must be of outstanding quality if family breeding is to be used".
Not to stir the pot, but earlier on this thread you listed a handfull of World Champion females you'd want a pup out of.I might point out that these represent individual dogs and not a bloodline.In keeping with you statement about today's dogs being faster and stronger [Deep breath here ] I had the opportunity to watch one of these World Champions on two different occasions.One as a handler and one as a cast spectator.I don't know what she looks like on a regular basis but both times I saw her she was FAST and STRONG alright.So fast and strong that I watched her blow through multiple checks ,watched her blow by the squating rabbit and carry a non-existing line a good100-200 yards wide open while a much slower hound checked her from behind on several occasions.Not making any judgements here and not going to name the dog,just telling you what I saw.

[sanfordssj]

Sandfordssj
In one of your posts on this thread you mentioned that the hounds of today are faster and stronger and that the Ninja blood was too far back and thus not of much influence if I get your post right.Ninja has been dead since '95 and granted "HE" is getting further and further removed in today's pedigrees that you see.But,I strongly disagree that his influence in producing the traits so many liked in him can not be maintained through selective linebreeding.It goes without saying that Jack of all Trades was a top reproducer and his son Ninja proved to have the same abilities to produce hounds of the better kind.Ever notice how often Branko's Conna [ Ninja's sister ] appears in the pedigrees of most of Branko's best hounds?How about Leroy Brown [Ninja's brother ]? Reggie's mother is a result of a Ninja half brother and sister cross.I.F.C. Beavercreek Blue Max has Ninja as his grandsire top and great grandsire on the bottom.I'm not saying you'll get Ninja but, I do believe that with proper selection and linbreeding you can use dogs bred this way to maintaine charecteristics and type of an outstanding hound and the family of hounds that he came from and reproduced.
If you ever get the chance read"Call of the Hounds" by Del Cameron.Del pioneered professional bear and lion hunting in the northern Rockies and was the only full time professional lion and bear guide in Montana for many years.For almost 50 years he bred,raised and trained his own line of registered hounds.
In the last chapter of his book "The Legacy Lives On"he talks at length about breeding his "family" of hounds and I quote "It becomes a blending of charecteristics from various individuals to achieve in one hound that which perhaps was once in several.Once established,this blend continues in the decendants as long as judicious selection is maintained.
Usually it is considered that puppies recieve little from ancestors beyond the grandparents.But I have seen traits in my hounds that were common in ancestors seven or eight generations back.This merely indicates that the foundation stock used in any strain must be of outstanding quality if family breeding is to be used".
Not to stir the pot, but earlier on this thread you listed a handfull of World Champion females you'd want a pup out of.I might point out that these represent individual dogs and not a bloodline.In keeping with you statement about today's dogs being faster and stronger [Deep breath here ] I had the opportunity to watch one of these World Champions on two different occasions.One as a handler and one as a cast spectator.I don't know what she looks like on a regular basis but both times I saw her she was FAST and STRONG alright.So fast and strong that I watched her blow through multiple checks ,watched her blow by the squating rabbit and carry a non-existing line a good100-200 yards wide open while a much slower hound checked her from behind on several occasions.Not making any judgements here and not going to name the dog,just telling you what I saw.

I will see if i can find the book. dont get me wrong here...I'm on here to learn as much as possible and dont claim to know it all. I will put somethings out there just to see what others think and what they have done. There is a lot of good breeders on here and I like to hear the things that they look at and believe works for them. The pro's and the con's of line breeding, inbreeding, what the sire and dam verses grand and great grand parents bring to the table. I believe in strong females and that the traits that you are trying to get will only come from the first three generations. so, if Ninja, Heli-Prop, Turbo, etc....can be found in those three generations you will have a pretty good chance to capture something, but a water down pedigree isn't going to get you anything. Those World Champion females are all fast dogs that can handle pressure and get it done on any stage. If i'm breeding to trial those are the ones I would want to build around.....now if i'm building to gun hunt I would prop go in a different direction. My process starts with the female and then goes to the 4 grandparents. Thats what i believe is going to tell you what you will get. The one thing i know for sure is that its all a gamble, and its not an excact science. Your post is a good because you have taken the time to give examples and background to what you feel is the key to breeding. Its something that will look into and help broaden my knowledge.
thanks,
Steve

[hard on a check]

Sandfordssj
In one of your posts on this thread you mentioned that the hounds of today are faster and stronger and that the Ninja blood was too far back and thus not of much influence if I get your post right.Ninja has been dead since '95 and granted "HE" is getting further and further removed in today's pedigrees that you see.But,I strongly disagree that his influence in producing the traits so many liked in him can not be maintained through selective linebreeding.It goes without saying that Jack of all Trades was a top reproducer and his son Ninja proved to have the same abilities to produce hounds of the better kind.Ever notice how often Branko's Conna [ Ninja's sister ] appears in the pedigrees of most of Branko's best hounds?How about Leroy Brown [Ninja's brother ]? Reggie's mother is a result of a Ninja half brother and sister cross.I.F.C. Beavercreek Blue Max has Ninja as his grandsire top and great grandsire on the bottom.I'm not saying you'll get Ninja but, I do believe that with proper selection and linbreeding you can use dogs bred this way to maintaine charecteristics and type of an outstanding hound and the family of hounds that he came from and reproduced.
If you ever get the chance read"Call of the Hounds" by Del Cameron.Del pioneered professional bear and lion hunting in the northern Rockies and was the only full time professional lion and bear guide in Montana for many years.For almost 50 years he bred,raised and trained his own line of registered hounds.
In the last chapter of his book "The Legacy Lives On"he talks at length about breeding his "family" of hounds and I quote "It becomes a blending of charecteristics from various individuals to achieve in one hound that which perhaps was once in several.Once established,this blend continues in the decendants as long as judicious selection is maintained.
Usually it is considered that puppies recieve little from ancestors beyond the grandparents.But I have seen traits in my hounds that were common in ancestors seven or eight generations back.This merely indicates that the foundation stock used in any strain must be of outstanding quality if family breeding is to be used".
Not to stir the pot, but earlier on this thread you listed a handfull of World Champion females you'd want a pup out of.I might point out that these represent individual dogs and not a bloodline.In keeping with you statement about today's dogs being faster and stronger [Deep breath here ] I had the opportunity to watch one of these World Champions on two different occasions.One as a handler and one as a cast spectator.I don't know what she looks like on a regular basis but both times I saw her she was FAST and STRONG alright.So fast and strong that I watched her blow through multiple checks ,watched her blow by the squating rabbit and carry a non-existing line a good100-200 yards wide open while a much slower hound checked her from behind on several occasions.Not making any judgements here and not going to name the dog,just telling you what I saw.

I agree with you "shady grove beagles",i also think there are "some" people that get on this board,and talk a bunch of "BS",and they really dont know what the h*ll their talking about. Anyway i agree with this post,"well said".

[sanfordssj]

SANFORDSSJ: world hunts??? so you seem to be referring to (ukc format)??? just curious how many akc trials you have been to? or are you even an active trialer in any format? You seem to know alot about what the "trial guys" are breeding,but you still havent answered the question: what 3 bloodlines are all these trialers breeding??? Because im an active trialer,that regularly attends trials of different formats,and im very curious to know of what bloodlines your referring to that are fast an rough an are dominating trials everywhere?????

I have been the 2009, and 2010 Little World, and the 2010 PP World , so i'm pretty sure im current on World Hunts. I have seen some of the best out there and even owned a few. Never been to an AKC, but have owned an IFC that was a joke....so, you tell me what makes the difference if the dog is out of ARHA, UKC, or AKC? I judge LP and PP. So, I think i have enough credentials to make the remarks. Bottom line....you can run the same dog in ANY format and win and SPEED and LINE CONTROL will take you to the top in all three. As far as the three bloodlines that i feel like are making the difference in todays dogs: Hurry Up, Reggie, and Cinnamon Run. We can go on and on about if its a bloodline or a dog (reggie). Turbo has been established as a bloodline, and Reggie is the next big one just like Ninja (actually branko, but we have turned it into a bloodline now), etc....Thiose are my top three, but I also like ANYTHING out of Logan Elm, Sundown, and White River......sure you can attach an old bloodline in these kennels somewhere, but the bottom line is that these breeders/kennels have outcrossed the old blood to improve the speed. I'm not trying to start an argument with what i think, but more importantly start discussion!

[hard on a check]

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[sanfordssj]

hurry up,reggie,cinnamon run: these are the 3 lines that you said are fast,rough,and dominating trials everywhere???
you also said that reggie is the next big one just like ninja? well i believe that reggie has already sired about 140 litters an counting,not sure how many fc's will come out of that yet (akc/ckc). Ninja sired 40 litters and produced 50 fc's,i dont think there is much of a comparison there? You also said that you have Never been to an akc field trial,so where do you get your info or opinion on akc dogs? or are we simply referring to arha an ukc?

Congrats on your first post with something of substance!

Not so much the ones that I feel are fast and rough...they are the one that i feel DOMINATE. Why dont you let us know what your opinions / experience are! You seem to be so "educated" in all formats and in all of the bloodlines that you cant keep from challenging mine. So far you have had nothing positive to add to this thread out side of your Stiker, Shaker, Ninja post.

Are you and active trialer?
Do you even own a dog out of these three dogs?
Have you been to an LP or UKC hunt?

My experience with AKC dogs stems from the fact that everything I own is AKC. I owned Turbo Super Sport.....yep sire was an AKC FC, Owned a IFC....that means she was a AKC FC.....should i go on? Wait....I have own about 5 or 6 branko's (including a grandson to jack), a shaker bitch, and a couple of Ninja bitches, 4 or 5 out of Reggie......sounds like I may know something!

Join in the discussion.....discussion...discussion.......

[hard on a check]

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