Changes for L.P.

[LaMarr Rhoades]

there are some things nice about progressive pack,and when i first started reading about it it sounded real good,but if you have a dog remotely fast your not gonna do real good.I have heard thow that some progressive pack clubs run a faster dog than others and i sure wish we had one of them.anyways about little pack,i think if the rules that are already in place were just more used more they would prob.be alright.I still think 50 points should be awarded to the dog that the judge thought was the best.If there gonna cheat there gonna cheat thats just the way it is.but i would like to think more often than not they dont.Also i think that points toward champion should be some how regulated by the number of dogs at the hunt.There are people up here that if there dog cant champion out they will just start going to clubs down south with 15 or 20 dogs in the hunt to finish them.Thats not right if there only winning in small hunts they should have to at least place more.

[briarshaker]

If you think progressive pack dogs are slow you must not go to any hunts.At the NEBC in Ashland Ky we run mostly lp trials. Our only pp hunt is the state hunt. At last years hunt the pp dogs caught more rabbits in one trial than the lp dogs did in 6or7 hunts. Those dogs could fly just ran a closter line and had a smaller check area than the lp dogs. Not as much over running the line. Not any cutting and swing to get to the front at any cost.

[chris herpin]

Trent I normally just read and keep my opinion to myself, but too many comments hit home for me to not say anything. I agree with you on the short check situation. At the world this year my friend Phil Walls and I stood on a hill and counted 4 checks that my dog got that were less than 15 seconds. He came back with only 1 check at the end of the cast. I can live with that. If he searched harder he would have gotten more 15 second checks. He got beat fair and square. I thought the judging was outstanding. As far as a dog that swings real bad. I got beat in the Champion class because my dog was swinging and swinging the wrong way. Because she swung the wrong way she was constantly playing catch-up. Had she swung the right way the other dogs would have been playing catching-up. You win some you lose some. As far as the question of which is harder to judge, PP or LP I have judged both and my honest opinion is PP is much harder to judge. In PP you have to stay on top of the dogs, because every little bobble in the race is a check, in LP you have time to cut the dogs off when there is a break down. I am 54 years old with a bad heart and I can't stay on top of the dogs the way you should, but in LP I can do a half way decent job. As far as barking in the check area I have seen dogs bark in the check area and pull a dog off the line it was fixing to go out with and the dog never went back to the point where it was, to get the check, so you're right. My concern is the consistency in the way a check is scored. In one situation I've seen where the judge gave the check to the dog that went to a dog that found the track and was carefully moving it out and fired out with it. Then I've seen where a judge gave the check to the dog that found the track and moved it, but didn't fire out with it!!! In your opinion, who is right. I think people will brain storm rabbit running for the next 100 years and still won't get it right. There are too many variable involved. Hope no one bashes me for giving my opinion, but I just had to respond because too many comments hit home with me. Chris

[KentuckyWildcatKennels]

I think that lp is startin to get rougher than it should ever be... so there is what i think.

[swing]

Me and Tony Kildow were judging one round and I seen a dog that would work the check right, and as soon as he scored the check and all the dogs would fall in he would break off the line and start swarming out ahead of the dogs to see if he could grab the line somewhere out ahead of them.
Thats a major fault I dont care who you are.
And by the rules I was having to score this dog, just so happened he didnt win the cast, and I was glad.

[Laurel Mtn Kennels]

Swing
Yes I think that running 40 or 50 yards off the line & giving mouth is a fault. Are you talking about where the rabbit turned & dogs are shooting out over the end, or running off to the side & giving mouth? This would be hard to consistintly give. Most of the time you don't know exactly where the line is. Judges need to give more minus for dogs pulling out of the check. These same dogs are usually the dogs that are running 40 to 50 yards off line giving mouth.

[swing]

Im talking where dogs are running off the sides of the line and giving mouth, you can usually tell by their body language that they aint got ahold of it and are just running and giving mouth cause someone is pulling there guts out running the line.

[LaMarr Rhoades]

i went to a couple pp hunts thats how i formed my opinion.like i said some areas of the country run a faster style.

[WELLS WOODS]

In my opinion, a dog that does that should be demerited or disqualified if it does it time after time. Hounds should only open when making forward progress on the line. On the flip side, running mute is as bad a fault as too much mouth in my opinion.

[TurnLeftBeagles]

u get 30 points for a jump how much more u want?i understand these dogs nowadays some will stand let another dog do all the work then check them to death but a good dog can jump and also checkwould make me mad tho to see a jump score a little more or a check a little less!and enforce the minuses more!

I would like to see the jump worth more, 40 even 50pts. As many times as my champion dog has been hosed on not getting jump points it would have made it a closer race when she did get strike jump over the stand around, mouthy, check machines, that came in and put up 2 more checks to win the race. Dogs that don't jump rabbits I personally don't care for.

[Beach Creek Beagles]

How about 10 points for a check under 10 seconds and 20 points for a check over 10 seconds. I know it would be hard to judge but could you imagine how quiet everyone would be counting time in their head and adding up their score.

[ky joe]

Alright, i agree with letumrun, i think that at the end of the year, they should recognize judges, i dont judge much myself, but i know alot of people like letumrun do try hard and do run there guts out and dont get any special recognition for it. im thinkin it would be nice if for regular hunts, instead of the rule being u have to have 3 grands to run a hunt, i think they should change it to 2. i was gone all weekend so i could go to a hunt this weekend and hunt my grand, i get there and there were only 2. so i was s.o.l. i wish they would change it to 2. it is 2 on the bench, why cant it be 2 in the field?

[DRamey]

OK, here goes. Strike in LP should get 25 points. Jump should get 50. Checks should get 10, with no time limit. All minuses should be -20, including extra mouth in the check area or anywhere else. I have seen hounds that could not jump their own rabbits but check the others to death become grand champions in LP. Any 5-minute period observed not hunting should put a hound in the box. If a hound is running a road, he's waiting for someone else's hound to do the work for him. A hound that will jump, push, and circle a rabbit with a few losses due to pushing hard that recovers quickly? PRICELESS!

[TurnLeftBeagles]

If you change the amount of points that the jump is worth that should be sufficient enough to bring out your good all around rabbit dogs. Scenario if jump was worth 40. Hound A drifts out by itself and jumps a rabbit. Hound A recieves strike and jump for 40+10=50. Hound B that was standing at the handlers feet comes in and scores 4 checks 4x25= 100. Hound A picks up 2 Checks also during the race for another 50. At the end of the hour Hounnds A and B are tied with 100 a piece. Through the tiebreakers though Hound A wins because of the Jump points. Did that simple rule change help the better dog win the cast, In my opinion YES!

[ky joe]

yes it did, i wish i would change to that