Enough already or more time?

[Bunnyblaster]

IMO, if you have given him plenty of time and tracks then let him go. I completely understand a dog needing to gain experience to learn how to run better on snow rather than sod. But if a dog can't smell the track then no amount of experience will make them any better at running on snow...........they can't run what they can't smell. You can tell by watching them, bark or no bark, whether or not they are getting scent just by how they act.......in other words by reading their body language.

I do want to ask just so I completely understand. Is the dog running the track and just not giving mouth or is he not able to run the track well with the snow?? Do you think he is unable to smell the track or is he just not giving mouth? The answer to these may change my opinion a little because if he's running the track just fine but not barking then I say give him a little more time. He just needs to learn to open up I guess but I don't think I've ever seen a dog do that before........at least not one that was already giving plenty of mouth on sod.

[mjs bunnybuster]

I do want to ask just so I completely understand. Is the dog running the track and just not giving mouth or is he not able to run the track well with the snow?? Do you think he is unable to smell the track or is he just not giving mouth? The answer to these may change my opinion a little because if he's running the track just fine but not barking then I say give him a little more time. He just needs to learn to open up I guess but I don't think I've ever seen a dog do that before........at least not one that was already giving plenty of mouth on sod.[/quote]



I am leaning more in the direction of letting him because of the answers to these questions. I do think this dog does not have the nose to run on snow. Like you said body language says it all not to mention how he uses his voice. Let me tell you when this dog opens on sod he has a loud beautiful bawl that makes your heart jump, but on snow he knows enough the scentings poor and will just yip and whine not daring to lift his head the slightest bit as to not loose the scent. Hes smart enough to adjust but his nose is to big a handicap for him. Thanks everyone for your votes and opinions. If im going to have a male I am looking for a special male for my kennal since I am parcial to females. I do think you know special when you see it by 14MO. This dog will make a hunter in a better climate real happy I do believe that also.

[NorWester1]

Are the rabbits running by you followed shortly after by your dog? If so then it is obvious he is getting some scent, enough to still run the rabbit anyway.
Although this hound certainly sounds like he isn't going to be a tough condtions type dog, that doesn't necessarily mean he isn't a usable hound.
This is his first winter right?

That being the case here is my advice. If this dog has the desire, he is running rabbits by your gun and isn't screwing things up for your other dogs you need to leave him alone and keeping hunting him.
He WILL get better at running in winter to some degree if you keep hunting him in those conditions...... that I guarantee.

I have run all sorts of hounds in about the toughest winters you can imagine hunting in and there is no comparison between what a puppy can accomplish in it's first winter and a 4 year old seasoned hound, even if neither are endowed with the best genetics for running in those conditions

[mjs bunnybuster]

Norwester, I do appreciate and respect your opinion. Heres the but; I have limited space for dogs, as such like I said before if I'm gona have a male I want him to be good. I started him last march on "puppy snow" through the spring, summer, and fall. We had a vary dry fall and that was when I first noticed it. Same type of behavier. I would still think that if he would get better at running in snow I would see some progress after 2 full months? Nw we are coming into spring again and the scenting will be better. Do I sit him for awhile untill a dry spell then solo him? As to screwing up the pack right now he does because of his drive to take the front without being able to back it up. Am I wrong about the best dogs showing themselves by ayear old?

[NorWester1]

2 mths is not enough. Not even close especially for dog that's having some trouble. Maybe two years

Regardless, if you are running a small pack and are jammed for space and this dog is causing problems then unload him and fill his spot with a dog that will be up to the task and will compliment your pack.
If you don't run a pack then it's really not an issue..... keep hunting him and hope he gets better as he gains more experience.

Once in while you'll hear of dogs that mature slowly and develope into something special. But generally speaking the best I've ever laid eyes on showed an aptitude for the game, so to speak, at a young age and got better from there.

Please keep in mind my input is based on the conditions I hunt in and my circumstances.

[dingo]

bunnyblaster:

One of the things I like to see in a young dog is over a period of time it improves in different areas. It does not stay at the same spot all the time. It may get better at jumping a bunny, it may get better at picking up loses it may get better at tracking it may contribute to the pack better those types of things. Your dog really has not improved for a long time and it should have shown some improvement some way and has not. Snow nose is hard to find sometimes. Not all dogs regardless of time spent training on snow will end up keepers. You said it did good all spring summer and then fall came along and it slowed down. Then winter happened and it has almost stopped. Your space is limited do not let your emotions override your common sense. Conditions are a huge factor in how dogs run. If you only want to listen to a dog run then keep it and only turn it loose in the spring and summer. If you have a hunting season and you want to hunt and that season happens in fall and winter get ready to be very frustrated. You know what to do you just don't want to do it.

[bucks better beagles]

I don't think you gave enough choices in your poll. It would seem insulting to a southern beagler to imply that a dog that doesn't cut it in the north would do OK in the south. I have brought many dogs from the south to Michigan and they were as good or better as any up here and vice versa. Personally, I would never buy a dog that someone that says it can't cut it in one region but would do well in another. Where does my thinking go wrong here?

[mjs bunnybuster]

Buck put the stars and bars down. I diden't mean to insult anyone except for maybe the easily insulted. I got this dog from the south and he runs good on sod not snow so i figurethats how they like em down there.

[mjs bunnybuster]

Dingo
Your right. The only real job of a dog is to make its master happy. When it comes down to it that is the one thing that really matters when keeping a dog; does it satisfy your needs as a hunter / trialer. Im ready to move on although whoever ends up with him I would really like to keep track of him.

[jumpNrun]

give it some time a dog that starts like that for you should come around sooner or later if not time to go south where he likes it

[JCM]

If it was me, I would try to find out about other dogs closely related. Did his parents ever run on snow? How much mouth did they have? How did they develop? What about littermates and half brothers/sisters? The more you know about dogs from his family, the more likely you can predict his future.

The only way I would consider keeping him is if other dogs from his family have done this and gained more mouth over time.