LP Old vs. LP New

[Alabama John]

Hey Big Dog aaand SR Patch, missed your posts, right on track.
Carn said Native Girl could run a track check free by herself. That's a rabbit dog. But, that type running would not win any Little Pack trials as the 15 second rule would kill her. Happened to me once where my dog ran ahead of all the others and for all intents was running solo, check free, and when he came by after the rabbit, the judges said he was sure a rabbit dog, but, not scoring any points except the jump since he was running too solid. 'Too Solid?" a term I had never heard in Beagling. A dog that can create many checks, and that seems to know when 15 seconds is up to open on the line will score high. If you have a great track dog, you need other dogs that are 15 second check creaters in your cast to help your check recovery dog score points. The wild and crazy trial dogs do serve a purpose, thank the cast member that brought one.
WARNING: Don't bring it on a hunting trip.

[TC]

Hey Big Dog aaand SR Patch, missed your posts, right on track.
Carn said Native Girl could run a track check free by herself. That's a rabbit dog. But, that type running would not win any Little Pack trials as the 15 second rule would kill her. Happened to me once where my dog ran ahead of all the others and for all intents was running solo, check free, and when he came by after the rabbit, the judges said he was sure a rabbit dog, but, not scoring any points except the jump since he was running too solid. 'Too Solid?" a term I had never heard in Beagling. A dog that can create many checks, and that seems to know when 15 seconds is up to open on the line will score high. If you have a great track dog, you need other dogs that are 15 second check creaters in your cast to help your check recovery dog score points. The wild and crazy trial dogs do serve a purpose, thank the cast member that brought one.
WARNING: Don't bring it on a hunting trip.

Gota Agree here i have seen that myself a few times....
Dog 1 jump run 50 yards check pick it up go 20 yards then a loss
Dog 2 jump Run it 45 min No Checks no loss (EXCEPT the CAST!!!)
Dog 1 Wins!!!!

[old blood beagles]

I did not go to the field trials back in the late 80's early 90's but I did hunt over some of the greats. It seemed that every weekend and sometimes during the week I would go hunting with Big Time, Little Time, Biff, Buck, Blueback and I would hear the stories about the field trials on Big Ben and Native Girl (never hunted over them). These were rabbit hounds first and trial dogs second, if it was rabbit season there was a gun on the mans shoulder and a pouch full of rabbits on his back.
The above named hounds were trained in a completely different way then what dogs are trained today. They did not let the hounds circle the rabbit twice before they shot it, if the rabbit jumped and it was out to a safe distance then it was hammered, and off to the next one. Back then you had true hard core briar bustin jump hounds that ran to catch and were rabbit wise.
These hounds became FC GRch and so on because they were true rabbit hunting hounds and now how many FC GRch don't even get taken out during gun season.

[Mapel Valley Kennels LLC.]

I must be getting really old cuz i have judged about every dog mentioned.Are dogs today better? Dogs today are different type hounds, Yesterday dogs could compete without a doubt.
I would have dropped jackson with the best of em, the problem with todays hound are i dont think they get rabbits killed over em like the older hounds did. Wayne waits Walter sharp myself, Earl bruner and list goes on, 250 a year plus per person. Why did we kill some many? More game and mouths to feed. We hunted pretty hard back then and it showed in our hounds, Our home club was shelby co. It produced 6-7 World champs before most placed. Jackson placed in the top 5 in every class, never won. But still a feat. I also disagree with big dog my hounds could and can run anywhere , I dont need ind to show up or do most others. A good dog will show up anywhere, Ky dogs seem to favor indiana so they can show there cards. They may not be the fastest, but they will not be shut out in most cases. Ky owned the world hunt for several years, The buckeyes have come back on us, I personally liked lp lots better from 90 to 98. Its as ruff now if not ruffer than ever, And i dont care much for lp trialing anymore. Dont have the desire. But i agree with Jcm, Old school was every bit as good as now . Try the Midwest , I have seen great hounds that can not make a round. So which is really the best?

[S.R.Patch]

I always hated when you took the cast to your best running spot, then they came came back during season and killed out the rabbits...
The Pandora's box of beagling...
Now there was nothing wrong with the legal taking of game within the limits, but some came for a killing spree and filled coolers full every weekend. These type usually like to brag of their tally at the coffee shop and I think a few of the old beaglers got fed up and had a head count done one time that slowed the killing down some.

Howdy John, good to have you back.
We all know trials are a fun game, if you got one that fits the format and can win. Anytime breeding for trials takes you away from the hound that makes your best rabbitdawg, it all folly. For those that like it, it's great.
A good smooth running hound that leaves little to check is utopia. That don't score many points in a trial but is a sight to behold when hunting.
I'm sure you were proud of your hound win or lose.

[Big Dog]

Hey Jimbo, Not sure what you are disagreeing with me on? I said "some" and took the time to underline it. I am pointing out what I as well as many others have seen in indiana. Don't get me wrong I have seen some real rabbit dogs at the World Hunt, but have seen others that just make you sick to your stomach to see the way that they win. Constantly slipping the pack, swinging out 100 yards or more and jumping another rabbit and getting away from the pack that is trying to find the rabbit that they lost. Cutting the pack or skirting to get ahead of the pack and then reeling off a bunch of checks because it can't run a line more that 20 yards without breaking down. Those are the ones that I am talking about, I have seen what you bring to the trials and I am sure you wouldn't feed one like that but there are many out there with titles that are just as I described. I know that the dominant dogs from back then would still be competitive today because they were rabbit dogs that have spent plenty of time under the gun, and the owner wouldn't keep them if they couldn't run a rabbit consistently without a whole bunch of cold trailing, lying and line laying.

[Mapel Valley Kennels LLC.]

No problem dog, I see clearly now.Can you say Dan The Crusher? Case closed.

[Big Dog]

LMAO, I didn't call any names.

[Mapel Valley Kennels LLC.]

I also believe Midwest gundog assc promote the overall best hound out there. They all got flaws but overall Midwest is by far the cleanist hardest hitting hound out there. I have yet too watch a winners pack that sucked. I have seen dogs in lp pee on every bush they come to and not hunt but did not get picked up as they should have and go on too win a cast after a race, ck you too death. My dogs just seem to fit in midwest better, my iron eagle bitch is as tuff as nails in midwest but cant win in lp .. Much too clean for lp. 1 hour cast just are not long enuff to show a hound in the field. And to date i have yet to figure where the ck is in lp. No one judges the same. And in 1 hour better have flashy hounds that hunt hard and lots of luck. Sorry boys just the way i see it.Been there and got several t-shirts.

[MasonsBeagles]

dont knock ole Dan guys. only hound in the history of ARHA to win two casts at the same time at the World Hunt...

[Mapel Valley Kennels LLC.]

Good point will i forgot about that one. Down 2 cks on cast he was suppose to be in.Pulled to another was leading by 1 ck, Drifts back to us and wins by 3. It left a mark I actually loved ol dan, talked to petey today he is still alive.

[MasonsBeagles]

yeah Pete was alot of fun. hate he doesnt run anymore. ole dan he was a LP specialist for sure.

[Murphy's Kennel]

I know these hounds could definately compete today and probably would dominate:

No special order(Ipersonally judge each of these hounds-
Choir Hill Bones
Painters Emmy Lou
JRHS Possum
Rockbridge Annie
Mars Hill White Lightning
Kiss' Lucky Lady
Damrons Halftrack
Bruners Big Ben
Bruners Lucky
Spicers Blue Back
Cody Sharp Jackson
Swartz Briarpatch Big Time
are a few that would getter done!

[il_beagle_boy]

did any of you get to watch or judge Proffitts Bobbie Sue and if so how good was she and could she run with the ones of today?

[MasonsBeagles]

i have sat and listened to the old school little pack guys talk. man they use to have some good competition and some great stories. listen to Earl Bruner, Wayne Waitts, David Schlaugg, Jay Painter, Walter SHarpe, Jimmy Abshire. Man they hit the trials and usually had the hounds to beat. Doesnt seem to have the Hound of the Year head to head competitions they use to have. I bet those days were a blast. Ive never been a big trialer and enjoy the hunts that I do attend but to hear those stories being told I can imagine what a blast it would have been.

oh yeah and I did have the pleasure to gun hunt with Cody's Sharpes Jackson and Bruners Big Ben and I am so grateful to have had that opportunity.