Trying to start a club

Jack · Post by **Jack** » Sat Jan 10, 2004 6:53 am

If I can get a club started here , what should the dues be per year? Thanks

Steve C. · Post by **Steve C.** » Sat Jan 10, 2004 8:41 am

Jack, I've been there- 10 years ago 4 of us started a club. Initially we just put up the money required to do what needed to be done. If you have to lease or even purchase land, obviously it can be VERY expensive. Then you must decide if a fence is the way you want to go. We were fortunate to have a large piece of woods owned by a major blueberry grower that was unsuitable for berries so arranged a lease. This saved us a ton of money but the legal fees for their attorneys to draw it up exceeded $1,000. We pay the taxes on the land which in this case are about $200 each year. There was an old hunting camp on the property which was in rough shape but restorable and we fixed it up for a clubhouse. As AKC is the only game in town around here, we applied to AKC for recognition. This is a LONG tedious process but certainly possible if you want to jump through all the hoops. It was about as difficult as applying for tax exempt status, if you've ever done that! We decided a fence was necessary, so dug deep in our pockets again and purchased enough wire to fence 100 acres and went to work. The wire cost about $5,000 when all was said and done. Of course, once the work was done we had a few guys interested in joining and lost a couple of the original members. We decided that the initial fee to join would be $100 with subsequent dues of $50 per year. We decided to put all new members on probationary status the first year to be sure that all members were willing to share the work and responsibilities as well as the benefits. Some did, some didn't. One good member will do 10 times the work of 10 poor members and cause less trouble. To answer your question though, you just need to assess your costs, including maintenance and improvements and divide it up evenly, being sure to have some surplus for emergencies and to maintain a cushion. Don't forget that at some point you'll have to carry insurance for liability as well as fire and property damage if you have any investment in a building, and especially if you ever plan to hold a trial. One of the things we wisely avoided was having one member own the land or front large amounts of cash towards improvements. Every member must be absolutely equal. As we found out, there will be major disagreements between members on a major project such as this and you MUST avoid any one member holding too much power or you WILL fail. I can't stress that enough. Many friendships have been ruined over conflicts concerning the direction that the club wants to go. I learned not to sweat the small stuff and try to get everyone to make known their idea of what the club should be about and what the finished product should look like. Get this done before the first dollar is spent and help each other out. It can be a discouraging process unless everyone pulls together. Good luck, Jack- it sure makes you proud when you hold a field trial and see beaglers come to your place from all over and look back at what little you started with. I know that's a lot more advice than you asked for, but having been in your shoes, I thought it appropriate. It takes some strong personalities to pull this off and strong personalities often clash. You've got to get past that as it can kill the club far quicker than monetary problems. I wish you the best with your project and if you ever get to the point of holding a trial, I'd love to be there for your first one!

TomMN · Post by **TomMN** » Sat Jan 10, 2004 10:22 am

Wow Steve, it's wonder there any AKC clubs at all. We don't have any here in Minnesota but there are several UKC clubs that have coonhound nite hunts. I believe that for beagle field trials to catch on here they will have to go the same rout. In fact, one coonhound club is considering holding UKC beagle hunts next year. I belong to a couple clubs here and the dues are 10$ per year, 15 for a family. One club owns a club house that we built ourselves several years ago on leased land (1$ for a 20 year lease from one of the club members). The other club holds hunts at one of the members' farm. Both clubs are successful and make enough money that the dues are not important. The best part about UKC hunts is that the members guide casts of four dogs back to their own hunting spots so the club doesn't need to own land. The downside is you need to have several members that live within driving distance of the club that can guide. Jack, I think there are some UKC beagle clubs in Washington and OR. Maybe you could go to one of their events and see how it is run.

Steve C. · Post by **Steve C.** » Sat Jan 10, 2004 10:58 am

Some of the New England clubs have been around for over 80 years. Fences first started to appear in the 60's and today, without a fence, no one will come to your trial for fear of losing their hound. Not saying that's a good thing, but it's a fact of life around here. A UKC club was formed in Maine several years ago but it only lasted a couple of years because of lack of attendance. I guess it's kind of like the football leagues that have sprung up from time to time. They just couldn't compete with the big guy. AKC has made starting a club very difficult for a reason. They want to ensure that the club is strong enough to last the test of time and will be a credit to the sport, and that all rules will be followed and enforced. It takes some major organizational skills to put on a licensed AKC event.

TC · Post by TC » Sat Jan 10, 2004 11:19 am

Jack

Steve C. wrote:. AKC has made starting a club very difficult for a reason. They want to ensure that the club is strong enough to last the test of time and will be a credit to the sport, and that all rules will be followed and enforced. It takes some major organizational skills to put on a licensed AKC event.

Man you said a mouthful there we have been looking into this and trying to get one going for over 2 years now. The other thing that you need to be aware of is territories Of other AKC clubs If there are any all breed clubs in the area then AKC may not aprove a new club without the consent of the older established club and that can Cost BIG $$$ UKC in my book is the way to go We are in Western Oregon you are always welcome to come down see how it works also you may want to contact Todd Morgan at UKC he is very helpfull and can send all the paperwork. I would love to see a AKC club in the area though so keep up the hard work and maybe if enough intrest is shown AKC will think more on letting us Here are a couple of links If you have not already Talk to Ken Jorgenson at CWBC he is working with AKC on starting a SPO Club

http://ukcdogs.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=3
http://www.cwbeagles.com
Ken Jorgenson membership@cwbeagles.com

Hunter · Post by **Hunter** » Sat Jan 10, 2004 8:25 pm

Hey Jack, I am Very new at this and still trying to get everything lined up. We are trying to take on the job of running an existing club. Our Beagle club holds its meetings at the local Coon club and pays a small fee for the use of the building. We hope to run our hounds on many different propertys. Doing this sounds like it would keep initial costs down. We are ARHA Progressive Pack Format. Hope you find something useful here, Paul

Goes · Post by **Goes** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 3:31 am

Hi Jack.
I have had the pleasure of visiting many of clubs through the Youth beagle Camp. When i was there at the clubs it was always their meeting night so I got to hear their financials. here's what i learnt from the successful ones.

I have a suggestion or 4...maybe 13..lol for you and starting a club. I to would like to see an AKC club out here. Actually I would like the Northwest to be like the Northeast. Drive an hour in any direction, there's a club. It doen't matter what type of club, just to see the sport grow. Grow together with field and show working together.

First. Check suitable land plots with current good timber growth. ($100,000)
2d. Calculate annaul taxes, estimate bulding costs and repairs.
$30,000 first year....$1500 each year there after. Whether it needs or not, put this money away, possibly in escrow for future)
3rd. Set up an appointment with a Timber management company.
(Free)
4th The timber company will forcast your growth and arrange to purchase the timber for a said agreed upon price.
($15,000 to $20,000 every 5 years will do nicely)
5th. get that part in writing. they will do plot planning for you and save you a ton of headaches and will help you regrow timber for them purchase every 5 years.
6th. take the writen agreement to the bank. Banks love timber companies.
7th. The money from the timber company will be used to pay the mortgage on the land and your estimated expenses.
8th. Do it right. Nice clubhouse with at least 3 enclosures. 2 for running and 1 for a puppy starter pen.
9th. With a nice club house and kitchen, dog kennels add a playground. make it a family environment.
10th. With a family environment you can then rent out the clubhouse for picnics, parties, etc. This is your cash flow
11th. membership. DO NOT CLOSE IT. meaning don't put a limit on how many members you can have. Just place a minimum amount of work hours that have to be put in each year by each member. Those who don't are gone.
12th. Trials. I was once told by an older gent from outside of pittsburgh PA that his club only held trials for the purpose of getting more members. That's where the stability comes from he said. And by the way, this club is the oldest in the state.
13th. Fees. If properly managed, your fees should be so minute that any Joe can afford them. You want a beagling community, not a country club.

To answer the real question. No more than $125 a year. But would prefer it under $100.

And then, no this is the most important part Jack...you ready........................

have your club host a Youth Beagle Camp

Good luck Jack and let me know if there is anything that i can do to help.

Your friend

Goes

Jack · Post by **Jack** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 4:57 am

My shirt collar is already getting tight. But I will call AKC Monday morning and see just what needs to done. But it seems that I again am way behind and out of step.

Beagle Bum · Post by **Beagle Bum** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 9:37 am

Jack,
Just wanted to let you know that AKC is not the only game in town. We have AKC clubs in Georgia but we also have eight ARHA clubs in Georgia. And I'll bet we have as much fun at our ARHA clubs as the folks do at the AKC clubs (maybe more!).
What I'm trying to say is, look at the other possibilities (e.g. ARHA, UKC and the others that are out there) before you decide which way to go. It seems to me (from what is being said in the replies to your post) that it is a real pain in the b. . . . to start up an AKC club. The question I'd want to ask, "Is it worth it?" Specially since there are other options.
We charge $25.00 per year per member and we give students and seniors (65 and older) Honorary Membership with full rights and previleges.
Best of luck to you with your efforts.

Post by **Bev** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 11:37 am

Jack, don't rule out UKC. It doesn't cost a penny to host your first UKC event. They waive the first license fee and recording fees, they don't rquire a membershp fee. Just fill out the new club packet you got, get your beaglers together, get your running spots lined up and you're ready to go. Don't worry about trophies the first few events - certificate or ribbons, or even new dayglo leads as prizes will work. The paperwork's pretty easy to complete after the hunt as well. You can have everything ready to mail in before the cook gets the kitchen cleaned up. Just a thought.

Goes · Post by **Goes** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 12:04 pm

Jack I agree, the AKC is not the only nor is it the best game in town. I tell you what I would love to see out here. the fenced part. This allows you to apply and recieve permission to run your dogs year round in a safe and LEGAL environement.
If i could add anything to the clubs out here it is that. At least 60 acreas enclosed with about a 7 foot high fence. No deer, no other game, a perfect plce to spend the summer months make it ideal for your members. If you have this, I wouldn't care if it was the JKC, Jacks' kennel Club, I'd pay.

As for calling the AKC, they told me you have to get your members together, decide on your officers, you get some judges, and host 2 funs hunts within 1 year to qualify to become eligible to host an AKC sanctioned event. Then at least 1 a year.

This is what I remember from talking with them last year, a few of us looked into putting one in another one in NY

I have looking around here for some land. I figure another UKC club over here woud work out just fine. This driving for 4 hours to Oregon and 2 and 1/2 hours up North will get old quick. We need something in between to break it up.

Good luck Jack

Goes

Jack · Post by **Jack** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 3:54 pm

Here is the way I am thinking, UKC. A bench show in the spring . I am a Ukc bench judge. I will enter no dogs. I have the land myself to camp on. I have a very good camp cook that will help me out. The boys that have been to Montanta on our camp hunts know him well. This could be the first meeting. Thanks for any help.

TC · Post by TC » Sun Jan 11, 2004 5:36 pm

Count me in I will come down for a new club. I belong to Marys Peak hound club we do 3 to 4 hunts or trials a year but we need more. Also as far as your being a bench show judge YAHOO We only have one (Or are you the same guy)?