question about breeding.
Moderators: Pike Ridge Beagles, Aaron Bartlett
Re: question about breeding.
That is the most thourough answer i have ever recieved!! Thank you for taking the time. OK, let me get this straight, both the male and the female have the bb gene since they both have the copper nose and lighter eyes, ticking is a dominant gene and the father and the mother both have it. So the odds of me getting redtick pups or at least a few are pretty good, understandably there will be some with more blaket like there mom.
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Lefgren-Lane
- Posts: 135
- Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 1:56 pm
- Location: MO
Re: question about breeding.
Ticking is Dominant so all the pups will have ticking. The only unknown is "how much?". If the pic is the male you plan on using he is definitely a chocolate ticked hound. Notice the red reflection in the eyes. From a conformation point of view I like your bitch better than the male. The offspring should be a bit better than dad. I would expect them to be very useful hounds and like you it would be a breeding I would do. I see the bitch thinks she is ready (flaging) but from looking at floor I would say she is still a couple days away, since the discharge is so red. Anyway go for the breeding. I will be very interested in the outcome. Please post pic of pups etc. We should be able to learn more about the parents color genetics once we see the pups.
Kodiac,
From obsevation we currently know this about the proposed parents color genetics. (The correct way to say this, "from looking at the parents phenotype we can say this about thier color genotype".)
Dam genotype is: a-sa, a-sa: bbD?E?T?: s-p,s-p
Sire genotype is: the same.
The sire just has more ticking and is more open marked (higher percent of white area). Not any different genetically as near as we can tell at the moment except for amount or degree of white, ticking etc.
The a-sa is for saddle pattern. All beagles are double recessive saddle pattern. The question marks indicate that we do not know for sure whether the second gene of these particular gene pairs are dominant (the upper case) or a recessive (lower case),indicating the hound while not exhibiting a characteristic is a "carrier" of that characteristic. When we see pups or get some additional info or pics of Grand Sire or Dam we can possibly fill in those question marks.
A couple other quick observations. I did not notice any indications of "fused" or "stiff" vertibrae in either hounds tail. (That is also a recessive.) (Instead of a smooth saber curve you at times will see what looks like a flat spot, or interruption of the curve. You can feel them by running your hand along the tail.) Also I did not notice any indications of rear dew claws in the pics. Most breeders will remove these. Rear Dew claws are also an autosomal recessive.
One more quick observation, sorry. Trim thier nails. Long nails tip them back on thier feet and put more strain on ligaments. pastern and also contibute to flattening, splaying or breaking down the foot. Kenneling on wire can also contribute to feet splaying etc. The feet of both these hounds appear to be fine at the moment, trimming nails will help keep them that way. The back feet of bitch in lower pic and how pointed the claws were on front of male caught my eye.
Kodiac,
From obsevation we currently know this about the proposed parents color genetics. (The correct way to say this, "from looking at the parents phenotype we can say this about thier color genotype".)
Dam genotype is: a-sa, a-sa: bbD?E?T?: s-p,s-p
Sire genotype is: the same.
The sire just has more ticking and is more open marked (higher percent of white area). Not any different genetically as near as we can tell at the moment except for amount or degree of white, ticking etc.
The a-sa is for saddle pattern. All beagles are double recessive saddle pattern. The question marks indicate that we do not know for sure whether the second gene of these particular gene pairs are dominant (the upper case) or a recessive (lower case),indicating the hound while not exhibiting a characteristic is a "carrier" of that characteristic. When we see pups or get some additional info or pics of Grand Sire or Dam we can possibly fill in those question marks.
A couple other quick observations. I did not notice any indications of "fused" or "stiff" vertibrae in either hounds tail. (That is also a recessive.) (Instead of a smooth saber curve you at times will see what looks like a flat spot, or interruption of the curve. You can feel them by running your hand along the tail.) Also I did not notice any indications of rear dew claws in the pics. Most breeders will remove these. Rear Dew claws are also an autosomal recessive.
One more quick observation, sorry. Trim thier nails. Long nails tip them back on thier feet and put more strain on ligaments. pastern and also contibute to flattening, splaying or breaking down the foot. Kenneling on wire can also contribute to feet splaying etc. The feet of both these hounds appear to be fine at the moment, trimming nails will help keep them that way. The back feet of bitch in lower pic and how pointed the claws were on front of male caught my eye.
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Lefgren-Lane
- Posts: 135
- Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 1:56 pm
- Location: MO
Re: question about breeding.
Kodiac,
OK. Just one more observation. Looking at the pic of the male and female, I see the female has some tan hair mixed in with her chocolate blanket. (Notice the male does not appear to have any in his chocolate colored areas. Just back of the withers is the most common location for this to be seen.) The amount of and extent of the tan hairs will get larger for the beagles entire life. This characteristic has been called by some as "wilding" or "pieing". (In the UK there are beagles they describe as being colored "Hare-pied, Badger-pied, or yellow,pied" but appear to exhibit this characteristic over a more extensive area of thier coat.) There have been suggestions made for the gene that causes this placing it on the A (Agouti) series. Or the same series that has the a-sa for saddle pattern. I disagee with that. In my experience I do think the characteristic is caused by a recessive but I think it is caused by its own gene. I guess we could name the locus "W" for "Wilding" ot maybe "P" for pieing. The dominant would be "W" or "P" for "NO WILDING or PIEING" and the recessive "w" would indicate exhibiting of the characteristic. Thus your bitch would be ww for wilding and the male would be W? for not showing the characteristic. The question mark indicating we do not know if he is a carrier or not. The pups could tell us something. (This is just my own thoughts or observations as I have not or has anyone else that I am aware of ever done the necessary breedings to prove the actual mode of inheritance of this characteristic. Again just observations as it was not a characteistic in my own breedings that I ever kept any formal notes on.)
What we need to look for is the characteristic tan hairs showing up in the pups at say about a year or 18 months. If dad carries the recessive then we can expect half the pups in the litter to exhibt the characteristic. If he does not carry the recessive, then none of the pups will show the characteristic. (This of course all assumes I have made the correct hypothesis concerning the mode of inheritance of the characteristic.) If we something different that shows up then its the"ol' back to the drawing board" deal. Haha. Such is life. I love to see new pups. They tell us so much.
OK. Just one more observation. Looking at the pic of the male and female, I see the female has some tan hair mixed in with her chocolate blanket. (Notice the male does not appear to have any in his chocolate colored areas. Just back of the withers is the most common location for this to be seen.) The amount of and extent of the tan hairs will get larger for the beagles entire life. This characteristic has been called by some as "wilding" or "pieing". (In the UK there are beagles they describe as being colored "Hare-pied, Badger-pied, or yellow,pied" but appear to exhibit this characteristic over a more extensive area of thier coat.) There have been suggestions made for the gene that causes this placing it on the A (Agouti) series. Or the same series that has the a-sa for saddle pattern. I disagee with that. In my experience I do think the characteristic is caused by a recessive but I think it is caused by its own gene. I guess we could name the locus "W" for "Wilding" ot maybe "P" for pieing. The dominant would be "W" or "P" for "NO WILDING or PIEING" and the recessive "w" would indicate exhibiting of the characteristic. Thus your bitch would be ww for wilding and the male would be W? for not showing the characteristic. The question mark indicating we do not know if he is a carrier or not. The pups could tell us something. (This is just my own thoughts or observations as I have not or has anyone else that I am aware of ever done the necessary breedings to prove the actual mode of inheritance of this characteristic. Again just observations as it was not a characteistic in my own breedings that I ever kept any formal notes on.)
What we need to look for is the characteristic tan hairs showing up in the pups at say about a year or 18 months. If dad carries the recessive then we can expect half the pups in the litter to exhibt the characteristic. If he does not carry the recessive, then none of the pups will show the characteristic. (This of course all assumes I have made the correct hypothesis concerning the mode of inheritance of the characteristic.) If we something different that shows up then its the"ol' back to the drawing board" deal. Haha. Such is life. I love to see new pups. They tell us so much.
Re: question about breeding.
Wow, I am in awe. I took plenty of biology classes in college, but never had the knack for explaning things so as they can be understood. Genetics intrest me but is def not my forte. Thanks for the time and the obvious effort put into your answer. Oh yea, the pic of the bitch with the LONG nails was the day after i got her, she had a wound on her back leg that needed tending also. I will post some pics when the pups are born, should be March the 22nd if everything went right.